Well this certainly won't help...a true DJ software app for the I Pad...http://djdexapp.com/
Too Many DJs
- Thread starter ahoustondj
- Start date
I disagree.
I was getting plenty of free music long before the internet came along.
The whole notion of "legal music" is a red herring because, you do not have to own any music to be a DJ. The law only requires a license for the public performance of the work and it does not concern itself with the property owner.
At least half the clubs I worked maintained their own music library and I simply acted as the purchaser/programmer in terms of acquiring or managing those collections. I never owned any of it.
Private events have an even wider range of possibilities because they are exempt from performance royalties. You can borrow music to play at any private event. DJs do it all the time, for example when a bride provides certain selections from her own collection to be played. Whenever a bride would requests a song I didn't have (more importantly) didn't want to buy - I would ask her if she already owned it and we would use her CD instead. Now, it's more convenient to just buy it from iTunes, etc but, If someone had an extensive list of things I did not want I'd prefer to play it from their iPod instead of my wallet.
I'm a DJ not a museum. My job as a DJ is to PLAY music - not collect it. I don't have to be the owner of a track to "legally" play it even if that playback is a public performance. Someone else can be the legal owner or licensee for that purpose. The license is for public performance - regardless of the source.
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I used to be at the record store almost every day for hours. In many cases, you had to buy the whole album for one song -- tedious, but a lot of fun.
I was talking to a customer the other day, and we were going through some issues. This dude does like 2 paying gigs per year, but said he has about 140,000 tunes. So, I asked him how could he afford that -- his reply was simple -- his friend made him a copy of a hard drive he bought with all the tunes on it.
That does not make him a DJ, with MC and entertainment skills -- he just tells everyone he's a DJ, so he can pick up chicks.
I was talking to a customer the other day, and we were going through some issues. This dude does like 2 paying gigs per year, but said he has about 140,000 tunes. So, I asked him how could he afford that -- his reply was simple -- his friend made him a copy of a hard drive he bought with all the tunes on it.
That does not make him a DJ, with MC and entertainment skills -- he just tells everyone he's a DJ, so he can pick up chicks.
Dennis! Do you guys have to be jerks to each other? I know yous don't like each other but yeesh.
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Low bar to entry.
Rip a bunch of songs of YouTube, borrow Daddy's receiver and speakers, and get yourself a $1 RCA to Headphone cord at Dollar Tree, plugin your iPod -- Presto your a DJ.
exactly ..which kind of proves the whole "legal music" thing to be a mute point since having that hard drive has done nothing to advance him as a DJ. Collecting music in any format does not make anyone a DJ.
If that's all it takes then those are chicks I don't want!
Bob,I disagree.
I was getting plenty of free music long before the internet came along.
The whole notion of "legal music" is a red herring because, you do not have to own any music to be a DJ. The law only requires a license for the public performance of the work and it does not concern itself with the property owner.
At least half the clubs I worked maintained their own music library and I simply acted as the purchaser/programmer in terms of acquiring or managing those collections. I never owned any of it.
Private events have an even wider range of possibilities because they are exempt from performance royalties. You can borrow music to play at any private event. DJs do it all the time, for example when a bride provides certain selections from her own collection to be played. Whenever a bride would requests a song I didn't have (more importantly) didn't want to buy - I would ask her if she already owned it and we would use her CD instead. Now, it's more convenient to just buy it from iTunes, etc but, If someone had an extensive list of things I did not want I'd prefer to play it from their iPod instead of my wallet.
I'm a DJ not a museum. My job as a DJ is to PLAY music - not collect it. I don't have to be the owner of a track to "legally" play it even if that playback is a public performance. Someone else can be the legal owner or licensee for that purpose. The license is for public performance - regardless of the source.
It is a fact that the new technology have enabled just about anyone to have a massive music library, put it on a laptop buy some powered speakers and call themselves a DJ. It just did not happen like that back in the day. By and large one had to purchase the music and know how to hook up the equipment. They could not afford to do it unless they were getting a return on their investment. Sure, some clubs owned their libraries but that is not what we are referring to here. We are discussing guys with minimal and sometimes inferior equipment running around calling themselves a DJ when all they are seeking is a spotlight on themselves.
What's wrong with that?
It's pretty much how I got started, except Dad didn't have anything I could borrow and there was no internet. I started out with some pretty rudimentary stuff doing college dorms. etc, then moved into clubs. With word of mouth and more experience I made enough money to fund my own music, gear and advertising.
I don't think much has changed, really. The bar has always been low - it's just too many insecure people wishing they could close the door behind them.
Aside from the illegal music aspect nothing is wrong with it. I started on crappy bar equipment. We all know how much bar owners love spending money.
For .02 as long as you're doing a quality job all the newbies (with illegal libraries and home grade equipment) shouldn't worry you.
I just think you are wrong about that.
It may not have been a laptop or iPod - but 30 years ago with different consumer technology that is exactly what "everyone" was doing. The storage and playback method may have changed - but, the way people play and behave has remained a constant.
It sounds like you have erroneously assigned gear and music to the "legitimacy" of a "DJ?" Being a DJ has never been and never will be about the gear. It's about being creative - and that has no such qualifier.
There's really no impart other than sour grapes in the term "illegal music." The issue of Copyright (how you obtained a copy) and performing right (where you are playing it) are separate, so vocabulary isn't enough to change things.
Even the guy with a duped hard drive will be covered by the ASCAP and BMI licenses in place if he plays at a bar or club. With regard to the performance - it really doesn't matter if the music was purchased, borrowed, or stolen; so, the latter case isn't really a DJ issue - it's a piracy issue. The piracy issue is independent of whether the guy ever shows up at a club or event. In private he's almost untouchable but, for his downloading - if any.
As a practical matter DJs (especially multi-ops) have always been and continue to be prolific pirates. To blame piracy for a decline in the DJ business is disingenuous. It's essentially saying that it was okay when certain DJs were doing it but, now that everyone can do it's a problem.
It was copyright infringement then, and it is copyright infringement now. So let's not complain about the chickens coming home to roost. Stolen music didn't make great DJs then and it doesn't make great DJs now. The guys who cut corners on music - cut corners everywhere, and are no real business threat to qualified DJs acting with integrity.
The piracy issue is not hurting DJs - it's a distribution issue that has to be solved higher up the chain. There is no level of education and public awareness that will affect people who prefer to steal stuff.
There is such a thing as precedents, we see it every day in all aspects of our lives and the DJ business is no exception. People in some industries have long moved to set standards so that some precedents do not take root and become problematic. Many industries have sought to even register/certify these standards so it does not become a free for all.
Take for instance, in most states one has to be certified to become a Rigger, Real Estate Agent, Life Insurance Agent, Registered Interior Designer, Wedding Event Planner etc. The reason for this being was that before these certifications came into place the consumer public was not fully protected against any malpractices. Being ignorant as to what to expect, they fell prey to the rogue vendors offering up their versions of Professionalism.
There was a time that the money was increasing for Mobile DJ gigs across the board now today I see DJs going out doing 5 hour gigs for less than $500.00. This is money I used to charge at a discount back in the late 70s early 80s. The reason being the saturation of DJs, qualified as well as novices. So it is a fact that over saturation does hurt to some extent, being a Supply and Demand situation. Would a Bride pay $1,000.00 for a Wedding if there was no DJs charging less than that? I am sure she would but why should she if there are DJs willing to do it for $200.00?
I would be honest and say that it does bother me some to know that there are some out there literally giving away their services. For each one of those given away that is one less Gig someone else could have gotten at a decent price. The fact of the matter is that even though a low balling inexperienced DJ could have been the cause of an event turning into a disaster, that is one event lost, period.
There is such a thing as a fair playing field, look at China Vs Us trade for example. We cry foul because of the very same thing. If the Chinese labor was not so heavily subsidized by their government, many of the jobs would not have left these shores. I don't try and compete with the low ballers on price. As my clients will tell you, one of the first sentences out of my mouth when I meet a prospective client is "I am not your ordinary/average DJ" then I go on to sell me and my services. By the time I quote price, no longer are they expecting to hear the "Ordinary/average" price.
Not too long ago I went to a Social gathering at somebody's home. They were doing Karaoke from some homestyle Karaoke system. The hostess was claiming to have just about every song. Long story short, what she was doing was pulling up Karaoke songs from you tube. Now tell me if that would have been possible when Karaoke was only obtained on Discs. If she wanted to have a Karaoke show back then she would only have a couple of options A. Hire a Karaoke DJ who had a sizeable library or B. buy some discs herself and be limited to only what she could afford to buy. So don't tell me that the common practice nowadays is not hurting the industry to some degree.
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Take for instance, in most states one has to be certified to become a Rigger, Real Estate Agent, Life Insurance Agent, Registered Interior Designer, Wedding Event Planner etc. The reason for this being was that before these certifications came into place the consumer public was not fully protected against any malpractices. Being ignorant as to what to expect, they fell prey to the rogue vendors offering up their versions of Professionalism.
There was a time that the money was increasing for Mobile DJ gigs across the board now today I see DJs going out doing 5 hour gigs for less than $500.00. This is money I used to charge at a discount back in the late 70s early 80s. The reason being the saturation of DJs, qualified as well as novices. So it is a fact that over saturation does hurt to some extent, being a Supply and Demand situation. Would a Bride pay $1,000.00 for a Wedding if there was no DJs charging less than that? I am sure she would but why should she if there are DJs willing to do it for $200.00?
I would be honest and say that it does bother me some to know that there are some out there literally giving away their services. For each one of those given away that is one less Gig someone else could have gotten at a decent price. The fact of the matter is that even though a low balling inexperienced DJ could have been the cause of an event turning into a disaster, that is one event lost, period.
There is such a thing as a fair playing field, look at China Vs Us trade for example. We cry foul because of the very same thing. If the Chinese labor was not so heavily subsidized by their government, many of the jobs would not have left these shores. I don't try and compete with the low ballers on price. As my clients will tell you, one of the first sentences out of my mouth when I meet a prospective client is "I am not your ordinary/average DJ" then I go on to sell me and my services. By the time I quote price, no longer are they expecting to hear the "Ordinary/average" price.
Not too long ago I went to a Social gathering at somebody's home. They were doing Karaoke from some homestyle Karaoke system. The hostess was claiming to have just about every song. Long story short, what she was doing was pulling up Karaoke songs from you tube. Now tell me if that would have been possible when Karaoke was only obtained on Discs. If she wanted to have a Karaoke show back then she would only have a couple of options A. Hire a Karaoke DJ who had a sizeable library or B. buy some discs herself and be limited to only what she could afford to buy. So don't tell me that the common practice nowadays is not hurting the industry to some degree.
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I know that a DJ can mean someone who does not own gear. When I lived in Boston, I had a couple DJs that used to hang out with me and we did gigs together. Some of them only owned the Vinyl, some owned a small system. I used to rent additional gear and a big truck on important and busy holiday weekends and book several Gigs for one night. These guys knew what they were doing and it worked out for everyone. I charged top dollar so I could afford to pay for the help and other artists. I guess at that time I was Multi op without fully realizing the potential. So yes I know that gear or music alone does not make a DJ. Can one find good DJs on Craiglist? Sure! Not everyone who charges big fees are pros or know what they are doing. I am still referring to across the board. The wannabees back in the days were mainly confined to doing home parties etc not going out doing other people's important events.
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The first multi-op I worked for was copying music onto single cassettes back in '86. The belief that there was this small group of professionals making all making big money back is a myth. Plenty of cheap equipment back then. I'm sure there was good ones and bad ones, just like today.
Is there more DJ's today than way back when? Probably. But I still don't think there is enough really good DJs. I also know that my success will never come from a lack of other options for people. There will always be other options for people. The number of them really doesn't matter to me. Being the best I can be is what I worry about. That and marketing myself properly. Those are things I can control so those are the things I spend my time on.
This business has changed over the years and will continue to change and evolve. We either adapt or we quit. Hoping for less DJs isn't an option.
For me, when there is more bad/mediocre DJs in the area, it makes what we do more valuable. When there are other really good DJs in the area, it raises the bar, more people want them, and when they are booked, they refer business to other good DJs. Our referrals continue to grow.
Is there more DJ's today than way back when? Probably. But I still don't think there is enough really good DJs. I also know that my success will never come from a lack of other options for people. There will always be other options for people. The number of them really doesn't matter to me. Being the best I can be is what I worry about. That and marketing myself properly. Those are things I can control so those are the things I spend my time on.
This business has changed over the years and will continue to change and evolve. We either adapt or we quit. Hoping for less DJs isn't an option.
For me, when there is more bad/mediocre DJs in the area, it makes what we do more valuable. When there are other really good DJs in the area, it raises the bar, more people want them, and when they are booked, they refer business to other good DJs. Our referrals continue to grow.
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I am not hoping for less so that I can do well. I am doing quite well as a matter of fact because I enjoy the fact that I have chosen to take paths that most other DJs don't. I don't know many DJs in my area that rent sound to bands and other DJs. I don't know that many Djs in my area who offer a Live Sound experience when doing a Karaoke or DJ show. The thread was mainly for discussion and I still stand by my thinking that over saturation has caused somewhat of a decline. That is just the fact of simple economics. Too much of anything can cause a price drop for some.
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DjDennis
RIP- My Dad (2011), Sister (2013) and Mum (2017)
You will always get new Djs because as I said these days ANYONE can call themself a Dj
all you need is an ipad and a couple of speakers with a amp
its not that hard to get music for a newbie, he/she would already have 90% stolen
where down under its a lot harder to say your one with out a few of the special Dj licences we have
already in place
here is a link to a few we have now!
http://www.ppca.com.au/music-users-/tariffs/
WE even have to get a WEBCASTING licence to work online!!
http://www.ppca.com.au/music-users-/webcastlicensing/
and you think its easy where you guys are - not for use here it aint!!
all you need is an ipad and a couple of speakers with a amp
its not that hard to get music for a newbie, he/she would already have 90% stolen
where down under its a lot harder to say your one with out a few of the special Dj licences we have
already in place
here is a link to a few we have now!
http://www.ppca.com.au/music-users-/tariffs/
WE even have to get a WEBCASTING licence to work online!!
http://www.ppca.com.au/music-users-/webcastlicensing/
and you think its easy where you guys are - not for use here it aint!!
This is possibly the easiest question to answer.....how do they know? You give them references and offer the references amid the conversation. Some may follow them up, some may not. If you have your gigs, equipment and reviews all available for potential clients to see what they are getting, they will have a feeling/knowing if you are right to serve their needs. Most of our work is referral or word of mouth....that is how people know who "we" are....it's not hard to see why I've been running since 1986 and the company since 1975.
To your out question......yes, every detail is important, that is what sets pros against rookies/hacks.....you're being paid top dollar to make an event happen.....everything counts IMO.
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You are absolutely correct, I am sure the competition for the Dollars is fierce! However, a real good Photographer with a good website and or portfolio of Photos can stand a fighting chance against a wannabe with a $500.00 camera. At least a would be client can see a finished product similar to what they would be receiving. In the case of a DJ, you may not know what you are going to get until it is too late.
I live in a market of less than 100,000 there are at my best guess 50 DJs in this area. Some use crappy gear, some steal their music, some have little or no MC skills and one I know of charges $75/gig. One guy is doing video dances with really decent gear for $200 but here's the catch you have to have an available internet connection so he can play videos off YouTube ;/
After all that is said there are about 6 of us that are charging more than ever and are busier than ever. Bad quality has a short term effect they take a few gigs here and there but either they don't charge enough to replace gear when it breaks or they suck. Eventually everyone will look for quality
After all that is said there are about 6 of us that are charging more than ever and are busier than ever. Bad quality has a short term effect they take a few gigs here and there but either they don't charge enough to replace gear when it breaks or they suck. Eventually everyone will look for quality
Bingo! We "sell the invisible". And that makes selling a service tougher and different. If you adjust your sales tactics a bit to integrate this, you'll be more successful.
My point was that in a lot of cases a potential client looking for a DJ don't really know what to look for. Some will figure why pay someone so much money? All they are going to be doing is playing music. Some make the mistake of booking the cheapest DJ they can find and not the right DJ to do their event. Now that doesn't mean the DJ charging 1k necessarily will be the right DJ to do their event or will be a good DJ at all.
All that says is that DJ knows how to sell their services and get paid 1k. A friend of mine who I used to work with that is a DJ told me the story about his cousins wedding he attended. He said he paid the DJ 1k and the DJ was terrible. So it's not all about price. It's about the quality you have to offer. Now the DJ charging $75.00/gig can't be offering nothing but a poor service that probably isn't even worth that much.