You are very welcome.Thanks for continually reinforcing my point about your tactics and the nature of your contributions in the forum.
The feeling is definitely mutual.
I keep religion out of it.
It's whatever the client wants.
Forcing your religious beliefs on someone has NOTHING to do with them caring about their guests.
I don't buy that.
It's not my place as the DJ.
Agreed. No one should be made to feel uncomfortable at any social gathering, be it a wedding reception or a girls night out. I'm just thinking about the B&G and what they're comfy with. If they'd prefer not to say grace, that's their choice to make.
That said, I do feel that good manners would dictate that guests be made aware of these things via an invitation note. Wedding invitations these days have been bastardized to the point of classless nonsense as it is. At the very least, guests could be informed of the important things. And saying grace is important to many.
For my part as a vendor, it makes no nevermind to me what they do. Years of doing weddings, I've been involved on both sides of the aisle. I've been asked to say grace or bless the meal before. I've been at weddings where there was no grace said and I was to call tables to the buffet.
Ain't my place to judge. Whatever turns 'em on is OK fine by me.
I'm really into the details and my brides feel they can leave the worrying to me.
Here's my planner: I guess it's attached.
Here's my planner: I guess it's attached.
I use DJ Intelligence, here is the info to log in and check it out
http://www.twojs.djintelligence.com/client
July 08, 2009 the password is odjt
Bonus points for figuring out what relevence the date has
http://www.twojs.djintelligence.com/client
July 08, 2009 the password is odjt
Bonus points for figuring out what relevence the date has
G
Guest
Guest
Bill:
Nothing was forced on anybody at any event I performed at or will perform at.
Knowing if they wish to a blessing ath an interview allows me to make a decsion about them. If they do not wish to do a blessing, I did ask follow up questions like, "Suppose your guests want a blessing?" As indicated, all except one thanked me for bringing that up and said that they would include it.
The one that said that they would not told me point blank that they would not because they did not care about their guests preferences. Please note that they had also told me that they only wanted me to play their music because they did not care about their guests preference in this as well. The question about music was before the question about the blessing and I was already considering ditching them. The question about the blessing cinched it and ended the interview.
Even that case nothing was forced on anyone. I just decided that I did not want them as a client and when asked, told them why.
In all future events through November if the client changes their mind about the blessing, I will not force them to have one. If they wish me to participate in the meal with them I will inform them that I say grace. If they object to that, I will not participate in the meal.
G
Guest
Guest
I only did one gay wedding a while back. I felt very uncomfortable doing it. I never accepted any since. So, the point is moot.
Here are Sarah and my agenda for the wedding and reception. I will be doing the meal blessing.
Ceremony:
Seating Parents/Grandparents
Processional
Toast/Blessing
Welcome
Song1
Message
Vows
Song2
Unity Candle
Recessional
Reception:
Announcement
First Dance
Blessing/Dinner
Toasts
Cake Cutting
Father/Daughter Dance
Mother/Son Dance
Open Dancing
Bouquet Toss
Garter Toss
Open Dancing
Mike
Ceremony:
Seating Parents/Grandparents
Processional
Toast/Blessing
Welcome
Song1
Message
Vows
Song2
Unity Candle
Recessional
Reception:
Announcement
First Dance
Blessing/Dinner
Toasts
Cake Cutting
Father/Daughter Dance
Mother/Son Dance
Open Dancing
Bouquet Toss
Garter Toss
Open Dancing
Mike
That is an AWESOME planning doc man, thanks for sharing - thats a great contribution!
Would you mind if I incorporate some of that into my existing planner? (see above in thread).
So, doing a gay wedding is exceptable but not doing a blessing isn't? OK, do you make these up as you go along?
Wonderful point Ron - Chances are that some guests at this wedding were, at some deeper level, even if they would never admit it outwardly, dealing with more internal conflicts about the marriage they were witnessing in this case than they would be about missing a blessing before their meal....
Who's looking out for their feelings there?
What led to the uncomfortableness of this event and the decision to not do any more? No doubt though it wasn't a rational and logically consistent concern about the feelings of the guests involved that we are told is the deciding factor in the other case.
DjDennis
RIP- My Dad (2011), Sister (2013) and Mum (2017)
Ken just one question whats with sponsors ?!
in 30 years never had it never will
its something that is well tacky sorry to say
in 30 years never had it never will
its something that is well tacky sorry to say
G
Guest
Guest
Go back and read. I did one once. I was not comfortable. I did not do any afterwards.
Maybe I should add that the one I did was back in 2005. My more orthodox religious attitude began in 2007. Since 2005 doing gay events have not been acceptable to me.
Please state where I said that not doing a blessing was not acceptable to me. I stated that I had one prospective client that did not want to do a blessing because she did not care about her guests and they were rejected as a client because they did not care about their guests.
In all future events through November if the client changes their mind about the blessing, I will not force them to have one. If they wish me to participate in the meal with them I will inform them that I say grace. If they object to that, I will not participate in the meal. If they go off on me I'll shut down my gear, pack up, and leave.
First - anyone is free to use any or all of the planner I posted.
DJ Dennis,
Sponsors - you make me laugh at the tacky comment. I can understand your comment with not knowing what it is for. I'm sure I would have thought the same thing.
It's actually a traditional element in Filipino weddings and some Chinese weddings. THe sponsors are family that are involved in traditional ceremony elements and they are also to be announced at the grand entrance time. So you need their information for the grand entrance announcements. THe most I have ever had is 28 sponsor couples. They shared ceremony elements. THis all involves the following: (it's lengthy but if you have Filipinos in you area this knowledge is an element to set you apart, it also establishes the fact that you know a great deal about all kinds of weddings with non-filipino clients.)
Arrhae or Coin Ceremony: The Priest/Minister then drops 13 pieces of coins (silver or gold) called arras into the Groom's waiting hands, who in turn drops it into the Bride's hands. The Bride then puts her hand above the Groom's then drops the arras into his hands again. The Groom allows the coins to then be dropped into a plate held by an acolyte.
History
The custom of the wedding unity coins originated in Spain. The madrina de arras holds the thirteen gold unity coins (arras) are given to the bride by the bridegroom, signifying he will support her. Often presented in ornate boxes or gift trays, this represents the bride?s dowry and holds good wishes for prosperity. These coins become a part of their family heirloom.
Groom?s pledge to the bride
The groom gives the bride thirteen gold unity coins as a symbol of his unquestionable trust and confidence. The symbolism, which may be explained by the officiant, is that the Groom recognizes his responsibility as a provider, and pledges his ability to support and care for her. Acceptance by the bride means taking that trust and confidence unconditionally with total dedication and prudence.
Why 13 coins?
The number 13 represents Christ and his 12 apostles.
How to use in ceremony
The Unity coins are presented to the priest by a friend or relative (usually the purchaser). The priest then blesses the coins and hands them to the bride who places them in the groom's cupped hands at the beginning of the ceremony. The coins are then placed on a tray and handed to an assistant to be held until later in the ceremony. Near the end of the ceremony the box and coins are given to the priest who places the unity coins in the box and hands them to the groom.
The groom will then pour the unity coins into the bride's cupped hands and places the box on top. This represent his giving her control as his mistress of all his worldly goods. (Sometimes their hands are tied with a ribbon for this portion of the ceremony.)
The metal tinkling of the coins being passed from one pair of hands to the other, is a distinctive reminder of the groom's promise to take care of his wife materially. The bride in return, by giving back the coins to his hands, convey that what they both earn become part of each other's. The trickling sound also signifies abundance and success in the couple's joint efforts. The husband gives his material earnings to his wife who manages, saves and invests the money wisely, as basic Filipino tradition dictates.
Veil Ceremony: In the Catholic ceremony, the Priest continues with the nuptial mass until the "Sanctus". When the bell for the Sanctus rings, it is also a signal for the veil sponsors to come up to the altar. In Protestant ceremonies, the Minister explains the veil ceremony to the congregation and this constitutes as the cue for the veil sponsors.
Together, they pin a veil from the groom's shoulders, extending it to cover the bride's head and shoulders. This is symbolic of the groom pledging his strength and protection to his bride - the wife who he promises to take care of, from this day forward.
Cord Ceremony: The Cord Ceremony follows immediately after. The Cord Sponsors come up to where the Bride and Groom are kneeling, and put a figure of eight cord over the veils that are on the heads and shoulders of the Bride and Groom. This cord symbolizes unity and infinity - a love together, forever!
Candle Ceremony: The Candle Ceremony is first and last. As soon as all the primary and secondary sponsors have been seated, the Candle Sponsors proceed to the altar where they light the two side candles beside the middle and larger (unity) candle. This represents the two lives and two spirits who will be joined together.
Towards the end of the ceremony, at a signal from the Priest/Minister, the Bride and Groom come up and approach the candles. They each take the smaller candles, and use it to light the middle unity candle. This means that from then on, their lives go together, kindled as one.
The Unity Candle is saved and kept by the couple, to be lighted on each wedding anniversary, as a reminder of this first day when they gave their promise to each other.
THus, sponsors to involve the families.
DJ Dennis,
Sponsors - you make me laugh at the tacky comment. I can understand your comment with not knowing what it is for. I'm sure I would have thought the same thing.
It's actually a traditional element in Filipino weddings and some Chinese weddings. THe sponsors are family that are involved in traditional ceremony elements and they are also to be announced at the grand entrance time. So you need their information for the grand entrance announcements. THe most I have ever had is 28 sponsor couples. They shared ceremony elements. THis all involves the following: (it's lengthy but if you have Filipinos in you area this knowledge is an element to set you apart, it also establishes the fact that you know a great deal about all kinds of weddings with non-filipino clients.)
Arrhae or Coin Ceremony: The Priest/Minister then drops 13 pieces of coins (silver or gold) called arras into the Groom's waiting hands, who in turn drops it into the Bride's hands. The Bride then puts her hand above the Groom's then drops the arras into his hands again. The Groom allows the coins to then be dropped into a plate held by an acolyte.
History
The custom of the wedding unity coins originated in Spain. The madrina de arras holds the thirteen gold unity coins (arras) are given to the bride by the bridegroom, signifying he will support her. Often presented in ornate boxes or gift trays, this represents the bride?s dowry and holds good wishes for prosperity. These coins become a part of their family heirloom.
Groom?s pledge to the bride
The groom gives the bride thirteen gold unity coins as a symbol of his unquestionable trust and confidence. The symbolism, which may be explained by the officiant, is that the Groom recognizes his responsibility as a provider, and pledges his ability to support and care for her. Acceptance by the bride means taking that trust and confidence unconditionally with total dedication and prudence.
Why 13 coins?
The number 13 represents Christ and his 12 apostles.
How to use in ceremony
The Unity coins are presented to the priest by a friend or relative (usually the purchaser). The priest then blesses the coins and hands them to the bride who places them in the groom's cupped hands at the beginning of the ceremony. The coins are then placed on a tray and handed to an assistant to be held until later in the ceremony. Near the end of the ceremony the box and coins are given to the priest who places the unity coins in the box and hands them to the groom.
The groom will then pour the unity coins into the bride's cupped hands and places the box on top. This represent his giving her control as his mistress of all his worldly goods. (Sometimes their hands are tied with a ribbon for this portion of the ceremony.)
The metal tinkling of the coins being passed from one pair of hands to the other, is a distinctive reminder of the groom's promise to take care of his wife materially. The bride in return, by giving back the coins to his hands, convey that what they both earn become part of each other's. The trickling sound also signifies abundance and success in the couple's joint efforts. The husband gives his material earnings to his wife who manages, saves and invests the money wisely, as basic Filipino tradition dictates.
Veil Ceremony: In the Catholic ceremony, the Priest continues with the nuptial mass until the "Sanctus". When the bell for the Sanctus rings, it is also a signal for the veil sponsors to come up to the altar. In Protestant ceremonies, the Minister explains the veil ceremony to the congregation and this constitutes as the cue for the veil sponsors.
Together, they pin a veil from the groom's shoulders, extending it to cover the bride's head and shoulders. This is symbolic of the groom pledging his strength and protection to his bride - the wife who he promises to take care of, from this day forward.
Cord Ceremony: The Cord Ceremony follows immediately after. The Cord Sponsors come up to where the Bride and Groom are kneeling, and put a figure of eight cord over the veils that are on the heads and shoulders of the Bride and Groom. This cord symbolizes unity and infinity - a love together, forever!
Candle Ceremony: The Candle Ceremony is first and last. As soon as all the primary and secondary sponsors have been seated, the Candle Sponsors proceed to the altar where they light the two side candles beside the middle and larger (unity) candle. This represents the two lives and two spirits who will be joined together.
Towards the end of the ceremony, at a signal from the Priest/Minister, the Bride and Groom come up and approach the candles. They each take the smaller candles, and use it to light the middle unity candle. This means that from then on, their lives go together, kindled as one.
The Unity Candle is saved and kept by the couple, to be lighted on each wedding anniversary, as a reminder of this first day when they gave their promise to each other.
THus, sponsors to involve the families.
You never stated this explicitly, but it is implicit, and your justification regarding this using respecting of the religious sensibilities of the guests is at best a rationalization.
The only way you can be logically consistent in your position that you are looking out for the sensibilities of the guests is if you are to answer yes to the question at the end of this scenario:
Couple tells you at first meeting that they, and every one of their invited guests is either atheistic, or agnostic.
No attendee of the event would give a rats patoot about any sort of religious rite, and who knows - some of them might even be uncomfortable if one were present.
Since your stated intentions about the sensibilities of the guests were the sole motivating factor and consideration, would you gladly move along after they say this and dj their event, and help to coordinate a dinner service that included no blessing at all with nary a peep?
No wiggle room here. You would have to. UNLESS.... there were other considerations, motivations, or agendas present....
WHY?!?!?!? :sqerr:
:sqconfused:
:sqerr:You are so convinced you're doing the right thing... why stop now?
This is true - I get a lot of this in the Sacto area. The roles of the sponsors go well beyond the pomp and circumstance of the wedding ceremony and celebration itself. The ninongs and ninangs are kind of the Godparents of the marriage. They are peeps the couple loves and respects, and who are examples of the kinds of lives and marriages they want to have themselves. It is the purpose of the ninongs and ninangs to support the couple in their life together, to advise them, counsel them, etc.
Just knowing this and having experience with it has gotten me two gigs to-date with Filipino clients. With this knowledge and a strong collection of disco, 70's funk & 80's music you'll be unstoppable! (sprinkle in some cha-cha's and latin-dance too for extra-credit
)