Thoughts On This Mic?

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ahoustondj said:
I think that some equipment behave differently when used in conjuction with other setups. About 5 weeks ago, I did an Awards gig and was surprised to see and hear the announcer holding the mike almost at waist level and his voice came through loud and clear. At the time the mike in use was a Shure SM58 going through a Behringer compressor limiter then to a Mackie 14 channel mixer.
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The SM58 is a cardioid microphone. The Beta 58 is a hypercardiod microphone. The pickup patterns are quite different.

Hyper cardiod microphones have better off axis rejection, but that also means you need better microphone control to use them effectively.

Amature singers and speakers have LOUSY microphone control. That's why you are almost better handing them an omni (except they'll step over in front of the speaker and get lots of feedback). :sqrolleyes: :sqwink: That lack of off axis rejection SUCKS. I've tried putting pictures of proper microphone placement in my books, but that had mixed results. Half the time they want to hold it out to the side like a rapper, swallow it, or put it at their waist. And a handful want to scream into it (which is why I recommend using microphones that have a high SPL tolerance - and running a compressor/limiter - even if all you use is a hard limit to protect the equipment).

It's why you find a lot of karaoke hosts have 'decent' cardiod micrphones on stage, and then have a good cardiod wireless or two they reserve for the better singers who know to ask for them.

And unless I'm mistaken, in the set up you described, the microphone had to be run into the Mackie board, with the compressor/limiter on the inserts. If not, it would have to be run into a pre-amp, then the compressor/limiter, and then the board. Mics normally need to hit a pre-amp before you can process the signal.
 
JoeChartreuse said:
You're right in regard to different setups/different sound. However, the Senn is, no matter how you do it, just way to clear for karaoke. Every mistake will come through, and make medium level singers sound bad, and ....less talented...singers sound absolutely atrocious.
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Damn Joe, I have to disagree with you on this one!:sqlaugh:

The 835 while it is a good mic it simply doesn't have the clarity of the SM or Beta 58 in the mid range frequencies which is where the vast majority of vocals will be, it is colored way to much to the lower frequencies which makes it an excellent choice for baratone and bass vocalist, just as the Shure 87 and Beta 87 don't work well for baratone and bass or even the lower mid ranges, but is an excellent choice for tenors and sopranoes!

Honestly and I hate to say this but the little Peavey PVM 580TN is probably the best all around vocal mic as far as having a basically flat response from 100 hertz to 10K hertz of the spectrum, that I have in my mic box as far as handheld mics go! If I remember correctly way back when I purchased that mic it sold for $110 new!
 
Thunder said:
Honestly and I hate to say this but the little Peavey PVM 580TN is probably the best all around vocal mic as far as having a basically flat response from 100 hertz to 10K hertz of the spectrum, that I have in my mic box as far as handheld mics go! If I remember correctly way back when I purchased that mic it sold for $110 new!
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I do some voice over work for a non-profit on occasion (volunteer) and I'm working on a variety of other items as well. I was told by my vocal coach that I'm a 'basso-baritone' - whatever that means. :)

As for microphones - when I do that here's the specs on what I use:
capsule: 3-micron thick Mylar with evaporated gold, double-sided
transconductance amplifier: 6205M pentode vacuum tube, wired as a triode, military grade selected
frequency response: 20Hz – 20kHz ±1.5dB
sensitivity: 30mV/Pa (-30.5dBV)
max. SPL for 0.5% THD: 132dB (or 142dB with 10dB pad)
equivalent noise level: 18dB (A-weighted)
output impedance: 200 ?, transformer isolated
recommended load impedance: > 1 k?
connectors: 7-pin male XLR for mic output to power supply; 3-pin male XLR for power supply output
attenuation and rolloff: switchable 10dB pad; switchable 80Hz 2nd-order (12dB/octave) rolloff
polar patterns: cardioid, omni, figure-8
size/weight: 8-1/4" (h) x 3" (w) x 2" (d); 1.6 lbs.


Flat as a board - 20-20K (+/- 1.5dB is pretty darn flat!) It's not hand held though - it comes with a shock mount. They actually used these to record the piano on Madonna's last album. ;) And the manufacturing tolerances are so tight that you can buy any two and use them as a matched stereo pair. I can't tell the difference between the two I have anyway. :)


I have 2 sets of stereo match small diaphram condensor microphones as well that I normally use for acoustic guitars and the like. They're GREAT microphones... here's the specs on those:
diaphragm: ¾”-diameter, 6-micron Mylar
backplate: solid brass
electronics: Class-A FET (transformerless)
frequency response: 20Hz-20kHz
sensitivity: -37dB @ 1kHz, 0dB=1V/Pa (13.8 mV/Pa)
max SPL: 134dB at 0.5% THD, 144dB with -10dB pad
equivalent noise: 16dBA
pattern: cardioid

Great little microphones for the money.... (They're Pulsar II Matched Pairs).


As for karaoke, one of the best microphones I ever used was the Fender P-51. I'd tape the switch and they'd stand up to a LOT of abuse. Never had an issue with overdriving from the screamers, and they had decent off axis rejection and were decently sensitive. Cost was pretty inexpensive too... runs about $50 each. If I had to do it again though, I'd likely jump to the Audio Technica RC1000 - They're cheap, built well, and should work well for karaoke.
 
Ed,

I have several but my all around favorite in the studio is the Shure KSM 44! for small con mics I use Shure 91's which I bought as matched pair at a really good price used!

My wife won't allow me to purchase any more expensive than that one although I have a bunch of others for the studio depending on what I want to do!
 
MusicMeister said:
And unless I'm mistaken, in the set up you described, the microphone had to be run into the Mackie board, with the compressor/limiter on the inserts. If not, it would have to be run into a pre-amp, then the compressor/limiter, and then the board. Mics normally need to hit a pre-amp before you can process the signal.
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Thanks for all the info and feedback! The Compressor limiter I am using has four Independent channels each with its own settings, that is why I am plugging in the Mics there first. I then have a snake with four channels coming out of the C/L into 4 mic inputs on the Mackie, at which time I set gain control so I won't get volume feedback. Its only if a singers steps down and goes to the front of the JBL scoops/Lows that there will be feedback!
The stage is in the middle the speakers location is on each side corner of the stage on the ground to the front.
 
Thunder said:
Ed,

I have several but my all around favorite in the studio is the Shure KSM 44! for small con mics I use Shure 91's which I bought as matched pair at a really good price used!

My wife won't allow me to purchase any more expensive than that one although I have a bunch of others for the studio depending on what I want to do!
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I have about a half dozen microphones -but I only have a small home studio and don't record other people that often. I've been known to use the studio microphones for live performances of small groups and it blows their mind how good they can sound. ;)

Fortunately, I was able to negotiate a good deal on my microphones - and I'm looking for a few others I'd like to add, but I'm not in any hurry - particularly since I'm in the process of upgrading all my wireless microphones (I'm moving from the AT2000 line to the 4000/5000 line).
 
So in summary, if I can get those two Sennheisers for $80.00 for the pair ($40.00 each), its a good buy, right?
 
MusicMeister said:
I have about a half dozen microphones -but I only have a small home studio and don't record other people that often. I've been known to use the studio microphones for live performances of small groups and it blows their mind how good they can sound. ;)

Fortunately, I was able to negotiate a good deal on my microphones - and I'm looking for a few others I'd like to add, but I'm not in any hurry - particularly since I'm in the process of upgrading all my wireless microphones (I'm moving from the AT2000 line to the 4000/5000 line).
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The only "studio large diaphram mics" I will drag out for a live performance for anyone other than myself are the Nady and the MXLs!
 
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