djsarge
Mac Daddy DJ
Well I say there seems to be more evidence pointing for than against. But am I being negative? If so, prove it.
djsarge
Mac Daddy DJ
Pro, if there's no way to prove you correct, how did you come up with your statement? It had to come from somewhere. You must be basing your statement on something. What is it?
You don't get it. You're not "being" negative - you're asking me to show you something that doesn't exist.
If you ask around enough you'll find all kinds of "traditions" regarding the first dance. Some people claim the dance floor's not open until the bride dances with the groom, others claim she's supposed to dance with her father first - then the groom. Still others claim they're not supposed to dance until after the toast, etc.
All this variation is simply the result of observation and subsequent repetition. It's HABIT and not rooted in any particular historical or cultural ritual. Some "supposed" rules are actually just imitation of European monarchs - adopted by someone's personal desire to feel like "royalty".
An example of ritual; the idea of tying tin cans to the rear bumper of the couples car - is an extension of ancient superstitions where noise was used to scare off evil spirits that might follow the new couple home and bring them ill fortune.
There are ceremonial dances in some cultures that are religious rituals - part of the marriage ceremony - but for the most part dancing during the banquet is entirely for entertainment, especially in European history.
The dance floor is where the community celebrates. When the couple steps on the dance floor they are recognized as a new stage in the future of that community. But, this is the community welcoming them in - not a reserved space "opened" by the bride and groom for everyone else.
G
Guest
Guest
Folks:
Actually, the only "traditions" involving a wedding happen at the ceremony. The reception is just a party to celebrate the ceremony.
Out of sheer politeness these things should happen:
1. If there is a blessing then it should happen before the toast. Giving God thanks for the food and drink you are about to receive is never wrong, even if you don't believe in Him, doubt He exists, or have a totally different viewpoint on what a god is.
Actually, the blessing is supposed to be a blessing of the bride and groom and not the meal but who am I to get technical on this?
2. Nobody should dance till the bride and groom have danced. But, if they do, so what?
3. The bride should dance with her father before the groom dances with his mother. The bride is the one being given to the groom by the father and it should be his honor to dance with her before the groom dances with his mother.
I have had weddings where none of these have happened. I mean it; no intros; no grand entrance; no first dance; no F/D; no M/S; no garter removal, toss, or placement; no bouquet toss; no cake cutting; and no farewell dance. The party started with the arrival of the first guest and went till the end time. I've also done weddings for SDAs where there was no dancing.
So, a wedding reception is whatever the bride and groom want. The "traditions" exist only if desired.
Actually, the only "traditions" involving a wedding happen at the ceremony. The reception is just a party to celebrate the ceremony.
Out of sheer politeness these things should happen:
1. If there is a blessing then it should happen before the toast. Giving God thanks for the food and drink you are about to receive is never wrong, even if you don't believe in Him, doubt He exists, or have a totally different viewpoint on what a god is.
Actually, the blessing is supposed to be a blessing of the bride and groom and not the meal but who am I to get technical on this?
2. Nobody should dance till the bride and groom have danced. But, if they do, so what?
3. The bride should dance with her father before the groom dances with his mother. The bride is the one being given to the groom by the father and it should be his honor to dance with her before the groom dances with his mother.
I have had weddings where none of these have happened. I mean it; no intros; no grand entrance; no first dance; no F/D; no M/S; no garter removal, toss, or placement; no bouquet toss; no cake cutting; and no farewell dance. The party started with the arrival of the first guest and went till the end time. I've also done weddings for SDAs where there was no dancing.
So, a wedding reception is whatever the bride and groom want. The "traditions" exist only if desired.
Ron, a tradition has historical and cultural significance that transcends mere repitition. (Do you wear a kilt because it has historical or cultural meaning - or because that's just what piper's do?)
The cake cutting, something borrowed,.., best man, etc. all have historical significance and social, political, or religious reasons for how they came to be.
It is tradional to celebrate with a banquet. But, the larger segment of the populaion (working class) wouldn't necessarily have music for dancing - so where does your "tradition" dictating that the bride and groom must perform this dance come from? What is the purpose of this dance and why must it be performed?
Find me a historical basis for this.
If you gave a party in someone else's honor - you may choose to begin the dancing by recognizing the newest adition to your circle - but other than personal preference and a deference to the host - what is the basis for the notion that no one shoud dance prior to the bride and groom?
To avoid any additional nit picking when answers are given, please define what you mean by historical?
G
Guest
Guest
I don't wear one because of the pipers, I'm a drummer. The specific patterns of a kilt signifies a certain clan. Why do we wear them? Because most of us look good in a skirt. The fire service is steep in tradition. Do they all come from historical or cultural backgrounds? Are they rules written somewhere? Not all of them. They were created in the early days and in fact some not that long ago. New traditions are create all the time.
As does the first dance as I've shown earlier in the mess.
This is where you try to find some rule that must be followed across the board. That everything must be black and white. Traditions are very different from culture to culture, between families, from generation to generation. No one said there must be dancing let alone a first dance. But if a Bride and Groom wants to follow an excepted tradition, they way many people view a wedding format, then it is a formal wedding etiquette, tradition, whatever that the Bride and Groom are to have the first dance of the event. This has been excepted as tradition for many, many, years. You may not expect it but that's just your opinion, which you have the right to. But, the first dance does have a historical background as being followed as wedding etiquette. If a bride and groom does not wish to follow traditional formal wedding etiquette then it doesn't get followed. But that doesn't change the fact that it is a tradition.
It is rooted in historical ritual. As I posted earlier, in Western European culture it was proper for the host and hostess, Prince and Princes, etc to open a ball or formal event by performing the first dance. I would say a wedding falls under the heading as formal event. Supposed rules? Imitation of European monarchs? What you described is how traditions have been brought to this country and have been developed over the years to what some use today. And they certainly have been adopted to make someone feel like "royalty". They're called the bride and groom. They should be treated like "royalty". For this one day, they are the two most important people in their world. They should feel like a Prince and Princess and everything on this special day should revolve around everything they do. And it is my job along with the other vendors to make that happen. Don't believe me? Just ask my daughter who's getting married in July.
What you have written above has only confirmed to me anyway that there always has been traditions of a first dance as part of a formal wedding agenda. A tradition of many Western European countries and have been adapted to our present culture. Of course difference of opinions are just like traditions. Everyone has them and they can be extremely different at times.
Many, if not most, people understand and appreciate tradition(s). I do.
Others don't, can't, or won't.
W.G.A.S., W. G. A. F.
Others don't, can't, or won't.
W.G.A.S., W. G. A. F.
Wedding receptions here in KS rarely have the first dance between the bride and groom.
This is because all the little kids are the first to dance in the middle of dinner hour.
If see enough of em, I'll call em to the floor and play a game with them so the parents can get drunk in peace for a few minutes....
This is because all the little kids are the first to dance in the middle of dinner hour.
If see enough of em, I'll call em to the floor and play a game with them so the parents can get drunk in peace for a few minutes....
djsarge
Mac Daddy DJ
I do get the negative comment. What you don't understand is I was being sarcastic. 
From the Merriam Webster Online Dictionary.
tradition
One entry found.
Main Entry:
tra·di·tion Listen to the pronunciation of tradition
Pronunciation:
\tr?-?di-sh?n\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English tradicioun, from Middle French & Latin; Middle French tradicion, from Latin tradition-, traditio action of handing over, tradition — more at treason
Date:
14th century
1 a: an inherited, established, or customary pattern of thought, action, or behavior (as a religious practice or a social custom) b: a belief or story or a body of beliefs or stories relating to the past that are commonly accepted as historical though not verifiable
2: the handing down of information, beliefs, and customs by word of mouth or by example from one generation to another without written instruction
3: cultural continuity in social attitudes, customs, and institutions
4: characteristic manner, method, or style <in the best liberal tradition>
— tra·di·tion·al Listen to the pronunciation of traditional \-?dish-n?l, -?di-sh?-n?l\ adjective
— tra·di·tion·al·ly adverb
— tra·di·tion·less Listen to the pronunciation of traditionless \-?di-sh?n-l?s\ adjective
From the Merriam Webster Online Dictionary.
tradition
One entry found.
Main Entry:
tra·di·tion Listen to the pronunciation of tradition
Pronunciation:
\tr?-?di-sh?n\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English tradicioun, from Middle French & Latin; Middle French tradicion, from Latin tradition-, traditio action of handing over, tradition — more at treason
Date:
14th century
1 a: an inherited, established, or customary pattern of thought, action, or behavior (as a religious practice or a social custom) b: a belief or story or a body of beliefs or stories relating to the past that are commonly accepted as historical though not verifiable
2: the handing down of information, beliefs, and customs by word of mouth or by example from one generation to another without written instruction
3: cultural continuity in social attitudes, customs, and institutions
4: characteristic manner, method, or style <in the best liberal tradition>
— tra·di·tion·al Listen to the pronunciation of traditional \-?dish-n?l, -?di-sh?-n?l\ adjective
— tra·di·tion·al·ly adverb
— tra·di·tion·less Listen to the pronunciation of traditionless \-?di-sh?n-l?s\ adjective
djsarge
Mac Daddy DJ
One persons opinion of why the First Dance of the Bride and Groom is so important. Not to say it should be the first dance of the evening though.
It was months after the wedding day that I realised why the first dance was so important and such a vital part of the celebrations. We were attending the wedding of 2 close friends and their first dance was fast approaching. The lights were dimmed and 'their song' started to play as the happy couple took to the dance floor. Just like our guests a few months before, we all started gathering around the dance floor with our cameras as the crowd 'ooh-ed' and 'ahh-ed' filled the room. Unconsciously, our hands slipped into each other's and we gave each other a knowing smile. And, whilst looking around the room, all the other couples were too holding hands, smiling at each other and obviously recalling their special day. It then struck me why the first dance was such an important tradition. It allows all the other guests to recall their first dance and reminisce together and it is quite a special feeling.
It was months after the wedding day that I realised why the first dance was so important and such a vital part of the celebrations. We were attending the wedding of 2 close friends and their first dance was fast approaching. The lights were dimmed and 'their song' started to play as the happy couple took to the dance floor. Just like our guests a few months before, we all started gathering around the dance floor with our cameras as the crowd 'ooh-ed' and 'ahh-ed' filled the room. Unconsciously, our hands slipped into each other's and we gave each other a knowing smile. And, whilst looking around the room, all the other couples were too holding hands, smiling at each other and obviously recalling their special day. It then struck me why the first dance was such an important tradition. It allows all the other guests to recall their first dance and reminisce together and it is quite a special feeling.
djsarge
Mac Daddy DJ
1cus·tom Listen to the pronunciation of 1custom
Pronunciation:
\?k?s-t?m\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English custume, from Anglo-French, from Latin consuetudin-, consuetudo, from consuescere to accustom, from com- + suescere to accustom; akin to suus one's own — more at suicide
Date:
13th century
1 a: a usage or practice common to many or to a particular place or class or habitual with an individual b: long-established practice considered as unwritten law c: repeated practice d: the whole body of usages, practices, or conventions that regulate social life
Pronunciation:
\?k?s-t?m\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English custume, from Anglo-French, from Latin consuetudin-, consuetudo, from consuescere to accustom, from com- + suescere to accustom; akin to suus one's own — more at suicide
Date:
13th century
1 a: a usage or practice common to many or to a particular place or class or habitual with an individual b: long-established practice considered as unwritten law c: repeated practice d: the whole body of usages, practices, or conventions that regulate social life
Thanks, now you've gone and made me cry.
Would somebody please hold me?:sqembarrassed:
G
Guest
Guest
