Need your input on adding a clause for an outdoor event........

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Like I said, there are a couple of venues in my area that I have never played at because I'm not one of their "preferred DJs" I've tried to find out how I can be preferred, and they basically brush you off. I'm guessing their preferred DJs pay some type of kickback? Who knows?

I lost out on 1 gig because I wasn't on their list. It pissed me off, but I landed another gig elsewhere.
But, if a prospect asks me for venue recommendations I will not recommend them. Not much else you can do.
They own the place & it's their rules.

I just decided to move on.
 
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ahoustondj said:
You like to sensationalize things don't you? I still stand by what I say, I would challenge them. Ever seen those signs at the Toll Booths that read "Not responsible for arm damage"? Lots of people take that as something that cannot be contested if damage was to occur. Wrong! That would be like putting a sign in your grocery store that reads "Not responsible if you slip and fall on the wet floors". My point being that some people take things lying down. I was not trying to circumvent Union Rules or rules where EVERYONE has to conform. I was referring to those who were being unfairly excluded. Your analogy has no relevance.
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You would challenge whom Canute? I've been many places where a Union MUST do the work. I have no idea what happens if you try to do it on your own, but I have been firmly put in my place when confronted by the Union, for something as small as moving a small rug. If you choose not to abide, you will NOT return - I assure you of that - regardless of what you think you will do. I imagine the reason will be that you do not meet their requirements (as you have suggested) - and one of those requirements being, the Union does x, y and z. Take it to court all you want - and you will also be on the sore end of a losing battle - the Unions have much more money, time and resources to waste than you do.

I agree that some people DO take things lying down, but please do not assume that the majority do.

Taking it back to 5,000 feet, you may feel free to challenge a facility that you are blacklisted at but do you believe that any actions you would take against said facility would benefit you directly? Do you (or the majority of people) have the funds, time and resources to take on such legal issues (whether you are correct or not) or would it be easier to take note and move on?

Bill Kexel said:
Like I said, there are a couple of venues in my area that I have never played at because I'm not one of their "preferred DJs" I've tried to find out how I can be preferred, and they basically brush you off. I'm guessing their preferred DJs pay some type of kickback? Who knows?

I lost out on 1 gig because I wasn't on their list. It pissed me off, but I landed another gig elsewhere.
But, if a prospect asks me for venue recommendations I will not recommend them. Not much else you can do.
They own the place & it's their rules.

I just decided to move on.
Click to expand...

In agreeance with Canute, there's probably plenty you 'could' do to challenge this if you had a bottomless pit of money, time and resources to waste on fighting it. I wonder how much this added expense increases our costs.
 
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ittigger said:
You would challenge whom Canute? I've been many places where a Union MUST do the work. I have no idea what happens if you try to do it on your own, but I have been firmly put in my place when confronted by the Union, for something as small as moving a small rug. If you choose not to abide, you will NOT return - I assure you of that - regardless of what you think you will do. I imagine the reason will be that you do not meet their requirements (as you have suggested) - and one of those requirements being, the Union does x, y and z. Take it to court all you want - and you will also be on the sore end of a losing battle - the Unions have much more money, time and resources to waste than you do.

I agree that some people DO take things lying down, but please do not assume that the majority do.

Taking it back to 5,000 feet, you may feel free to challenge a facility that you are blacklisted at but do you believe that any actions you would take against said facility would benefit you directly? Do you (or the majority of people) have the funds, time and resources to take on such legal issues (whether you are correct or not) or would it be easier to take note and move on?



In agreeance with Canute, there's probably plenty you 'could' do to challenge this if you had a bottomless pit of money, time and resources to waste on fighting it. I wonder how much this added expense increases our costs.
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This has nothing to do with Unions. We are talking about someone being Blacklisted because they are not a Preferred Vendor, plain and simple. We are not talking about some Union DJ. Sheesh!
 
ahoustondj said:
This has nothing to do with Unions. We are talking about someone being Blacklisted because they are not a Preferred Vendor, plain and simple. We are not talking about some Union DJ. Sheesh!
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You just don't get it, do you...

It's not a union DJ, it's the union workers who haul yer stuff in and out. They have a contract with the venues. If you don't comply with their terms, you are blacklisted.
 
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SoftJock Rick said:
You just don't get it, do you...

It's not a union DJ, it's the union workers who haul yer stuff in and out. They have a contract with the venues. If you don't comply with their terms, you are blacklisted.
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Let me repeat this: The OP in the first post said nothing about complying, he said nothing about Union workers, he said nothing about loading or unloading! He was saying that if you are not on their list that you don't get to play there. I said, that is unfair because if the place is open to anyone that they are making it a Monopoly to exclude another DJ from coming in. Why are you all adding things to the conversation that does not exist? We are talking DJs not Union Workers!!!
 
I believe they were pointing to components of the venue that may get you blacklisted, and in union towns, NOT using union labor at the venue CAN get you blacklisted as well. The union labor is part and parcel with the venue.
 
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steve149 said:
I believe they were pointing to components of the venue that may get you blacklisted, and in union towns, NOT using union labor at the venue CAN get you blacklisted as well. The union labor is part and parcel with the venue.
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So big deal, that was NOT the original issue and conversation.
 
ahoustondj said:
So big deal, that was NOT the original issue and conversation.
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Little on the last couple of pages has to do with the OP. Doesn't mean there isn't value or that things can't be corrected and explained.
 
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steve149 said:
Little on the last couple of pages has to do with the OP. Doesn't mean there isn't value or that things can't be corrected and explained.
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Some Fishermen use boats, even though that is true, does not mean it has relevance in the conversation. Two separate or different things.
 
ahoustondj said:
Some Fishermen use boats, even though that is true, does not mean it has relevance in the conversation. Two separate or different things.
Click to expand...

Relevant to what? The original post was about noise and you have at least 10 posts in this thread about something else. It's all good.
 
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ahoustondj said:
This has nothing to do with Unions. We are talking about someone being Blacklisted because they are not a Preferred Vendor, plain and simple. We are not talking about some Union DJ. Sheesh!
Click to expand...

Who's talking about a union DJ? If you play / move / put equipment into a place where it is required that a union does it, you CANNOT move your own equipment. You also CANNOT plug it in.

Did you miss the taking it back to the 5,000 feet part? Jeesh Canute! (previous message posted below)

Because you obviously select which pieces to read, I shall repost it. Please read it in its entirety.

-----------------------------

ahoustondj said:
You like to sensationalize things don't you? I still stand by what I say, I would challenge them. Ever seen those signs at the Toll Booths that read "Not responsible for arm damage"? Lots of people take that as something that cannot be contested if damage was to occur. Wrong! That would be like putting a sign in your grocery store that reads "Not responsible if you slip and fall on the wet floors". My point being that some people take things lying down. I was not trying to circumvent Union Rules or rules where EVERYONE has to conform. I was referring to those who were being unfairly excluded. Your analogy has no relevance.
Click to expand...

You would challenge whom Canute? I've been many places where a Union MUST do the work. I have no idea what happens if you try to do it on your own, but I have been firmly put in my place when confronted by the Union, for something as small as moving a small rug. If you choose not to abide, you will NOT return - I assure you of that - regardless of what you think you will do. I imagine the reason will be that you do not meet their requirements (as you have suggested) - and one of those requirements being, the Union does x, y and z. Take it to court all you want - and you will also be on the sore end of a losing battle - the Unions have much more money, time and resources to waste than you do.

I agree that some people DO take things lying down, but please do not assume that the majority do.

Taking it back to 5,000 feet, you may feel free to challenge a facility that you are blacklisted at but do you believe that any actions you would take against said facility would benefit you directly? Do you (or the majority of people) have the funds, time and resources to take on such legal issues (whether you are correct or not) or would it be easier to take note and move on?

Bill Kexel said:
Like I said, there are a couple of venues in my area that I have never played at because I'm not one of their "preferred DJs" I've tried to find out how I can be preferred, and they basically brush you off. I'm guessing their preferred DJs pay some type of kickback? Who knows?

I lost out on 1 gig because I wasn't on their list. It pissed me off, but I landed another gig elsewhere.
But, if a prospect asks me for venue recommendations I will not recommend them. Not much else you can do.
They own the place & it's their rules.

I just decided to move on.
Click to expand...

In agreeance with Canute, there's probably plenty you 'could' do to challenge this if you had a bottomless pit of money, time and resources to waste on fighting it. I wonder how much this added expense increases our costs.

--------------------

On another note, it is obvious that you don't get it. If you get blacklisted and want to fight it - feel free. I hope your pockets are deep enough. Obviously, YMDV.

ahoustondj said:
So big deal, that was NOT the original issue and conversation.
Click to expand...

The issue, at this point, is being blacklisted - and your interpretation of they can't legally do that to you. Let it go everyone.

Canute - if you get blacklisted, fight it - fight it all the way with all the legal power that you can muster.
 
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ittigger said:
Who's talking about a union DJ? If you play / move / put equipment into a place where it is required that a union does it, you CANNOT move your own equipment. You also CANNOT plug it in.

Did you miss the taking it back to the 5,000 feet part? Jeesh Canute! (previous message posted below)

Because you obviously select which pieces to read, I shall repost it. Please read it in its entirety.

-----------------------------



You would challenge whom Canute? I've been many places where a Union MUST do the work. I have no idea what happens if you try to do it on your own, but I have been firmly put in my place when confronted by the Union, for something as small as moving a small rug. If you choose not to abide, you will NOT return - I assure you of that - regardless of what you think you will do. I imagine the reason will be that you do not meet their requirements (as you have suggested) - and one of those requirements being, the Union does x, y and z. Take it to court all you want - and you will also be on the sore end of a losing battle - the Unions have much more money, time and resources to waste than you do.

I agree that some people DO take things lying down, but please do not assume that the majority do.

Taking it back to 5,000 feet, you may feel free to challenge a facility that you are blacklisted at but do you believe that any actions you would take against said facility would benefit you directly? Do you (or the majority of people) have the funds, time and resources to take on such legal issues (whether you are correct or not) or would it be easier to take note and move on?



In agreeance with Canute, there's probably plenty you 'could' do to challenge this if you had a bottomless pit of money, time and resources to waste on fighting it. I wonder how much this added expense increases our costs.

--------------------

On another note, it is obvious that you don't get it. If you get blacklisted and want to fight it - feel free. I hope your pockets are deep enough. Obviously, YMDV.



The issue, at this point, is being blacklisted - and your interpretation of they can't legally do that to you. Let it go everyone.

Canute - if you get blacklisted, fight it - fight it all the way with all the legal power that you can muster.
Click to expand...
You are the one who does not get it. My contention isn't with someone who gets blacklisted for doing something against the rules.
It isn't about if some went and played there and pissed off somebody.
Everything you said about Unions above is true and I agree but that is not what my conversation is about. For the many years I have been on this Forum I have not read or seen an issue of a DJ running into Union problems. You and Rick just went off on a tangent about the subject matter.
MY contention is with blacklisting someone who has NEVER played there,meaning that they are blacklisted because they are not on the Venue's preferred list! It has nothing to do with placement of speakers or loading in/out of gear.
Now you know why I sometimes question some of y'alls understanding of English interpretation.
 
ahoustondj said:
You are the one who does not get it. My contention isn't with someone who gets blacklisted for doing something against the rules.
It isn't about if some went and played there and pissed off somebody.
Everything you said about Unions above is true and I agree but that is not what my conversation is about. For the many years I have been on this Forum I have not read or seen an issue of a DJ running into Union problems. You and Rick just went off on a tangent about the subject matter.
MY contention is with blacklisting someone who has NEVER played there,meaning that they are blacklisted because they are not on the Venue's preferred list! It has nothing to do with placement of speakers or loading in/out of gear.
Now you know why I sometimes question some of y'alls understanding of English interpretation.
Click to expand...


No tangent, we just understand how things work in society. You can get blacklisted for a number of reasons, not just the unions.

For example, let say I call Uncle Vinnie, who owns some venues, and tell him you are not a cooperative DJ -- you will get blacklisted by his places, and he will probably tell all his friends, who own other venues.

A preferred list, is vendors who are cooperative with the management of the venue, and the staff.

If you don't want to play by the rules, go hang more posters (or fine art, whatever you call it).
 
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SoftJock Rick said:
No tangent, we just understand how things work in society. You can get blacklisted for a number of reasons, not just the unions.

For example, let say I call Uncle Vinnie, who owns some venues, and tell him you are not a cooperative DJ -- you will get blacklisted by his places, and he will probably tell all his friends, who own other venues.

A preferred list, is vendors who are cooperative with the management of the venue, and the staff.

If you don't want to play by the rules, go hang more posters (or fine art, whatever you call it).
Click to expand...
You guys still don't get it. I will give you a scenario, maybe then you will understand.
1. Venue has a Preferred List.
2. Client comes and rents the Ballroom/Venue for a wedding.
3. Client has someone who is a relative or just a DJ they have used before.(We will call him Alex)
4. That DJ has NEVER played at said Venue.
5. According to you all, are you telling me that because Alex is not on the Preferred list that he can't or won't be allowed to play there? If so, what I was saying is that the venue is operating a Monopoly which is illegal. It is not a Private place because it is open for anyone in the public to rent. Therefore they can't exclude anyone. Alex can then challenge that Venue in a court of law for a form of discrimination and claim damages. NOW DO YOU UNDERSTAND???????
This scenario has NOTHING to do with if the DJ has pissed off the venue before, or Unions or anything else.

- - - Updated - - -

SoftJock Rick said:
, go hang more posters (or fine art, whatever you call it).
Click to expand...
Laugh all you want. Installing Artwork is very lucrative. Do you know what the pay is per hour on a retail Basis? $125.00-$150.00 per hour or per specified project (4 regular sized Framed Artwork). It takes me about 20 minutes to do a 4 piece project. and I still get the full price. I charge my Interior Designers $75.00 per hour. Why don't you go back to your Shyt Bucket and lose some of that shyt inside of you. Maybe then you won't be spouting off so much out of your mouth. Have a Nice day!
 
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ahoustondj said:
Laugh all you want. Installing Artwork is very lucrative.
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Fine -- if that's what you do well, than go back to it.

Given that fact that you are here most of the time, I'd take a reasonable guess, that you probably have no real DJ jobs. It probably doesn't help that you hide your online status -- that's a red flag.

BTW, you still haven't told me what country you were born in. It's really simple -- I was born in the US of A. I have no problem saying that -- why do you...?
 
SoftJock Rick said:
Fine -- if that's what you do well, than go back to it.

Given that fact that you are here most of the time, I'd take a reasonable guess, that you probably have no real DJ jobs. It probably doesn't help that you hide your online status -- that's a red flag.

BTW, you still haven't told me what country you were born in. It's really simple -- I was born in the US of A. I have no problem saying that -- why do you...?
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You can think what you want. You really don't know my business and what I do. All you try and do is poke fun at others to take the spotlight away from you. You would have been right at home on that disabled Carnaval Ship the Triumph. All that feces all over the place would not have offended you at all. You are used to it!
 
ahoustondj said:
You can think what you want. You really don't know my business and what I do. All you try and do is poke fun at others to take the spotlight away from you. You would have been right at home on that disabled Carnaval Ship the Triumph. All that feces all over the place would not have offended you at all. You are used to it!
Click to expand...


hehehe on the feces thingy... :)

Canute Joseph Chiverton -- is that the correct name?


I do have a number of contacts in DC, for ICE and others.

If you would answer my question, I will let it be...
 
I have played at a venue that charged the B&G an extra $250 per non preferred vendor they used. I then had to have a meeting with the venue coordinator and show my proof of insurance and sign/agree to follow their house rules. Here is a copy n paste from their websites FAQ

[h=2]Are there restrictions on decorations, flowers, candles, photography, etc?[/h]We are pleased to announce our partnership with the top wedding vendors in this area! Every vendor on our list has worked at Winterthur numerous times and with great success. We have enjoyed working them all almost as much as our clients – who have sent us great feedback.Preferred Vendor ListingPlease note that you may feel free to use any vendor that you choose. The vendors listed above have worked here various times with the greatest success. All of our recommended vendors are true professionals whom are familiar with our estate as well as the vendor rules and regulations. If you are using a vendor not listed on our list please obtain a copy of the rules and regulations from your event representative for your vendors to sign. We will retain the signed copy in our files through the day of your event. There is a $250.00 charge for any new vendor and any new vendors must attend an orientation meeting a minimum of one week prior to your event.
 
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