I suck at live sound!!

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jokerswild said:
Weddings are not the place for that "Wall of Sound" setup.
Click to expand...

Oh really??

I Have a very large wedding coming up next March. 750 people.

You really think a L1 & B1 set up will cover that amount of people?? :sqlaugh:

For small get togethers...yes the bose is a very good option...
But, just like the average Mobile Dj trying to do everything with a pair of mackies on sticks, the bose has its limits..

I would not try to attempt 750 people with it. no way in hell.
 
Generally speaking most lavalieres that I have used on most wireless sets, are omni-directional and are a PAIN to control. Case & Point. I was running FOH & BOH (aux on board) for a Talent Show, running the mics through my mackie 1530's (The House's EAW rig was incorectly aimed at the audience to provide sufficient coverage so I brought my better sounding more powerful rig.

This one girl was doing a singing number and her mom rented a Shure Lavaliere T-Series VHF Wireless set (these are the olde style shures if anybody remembers when). The lavaliere had HORRIBLE gain before feedback and I was fighting killing the monitor mix backstage and having to significantly EQ the Low end and the gain of the mic. No Bueno!!!

I was surprised the local rental house rented her that crap. I wanted to go slap the owner (they are the big AV house in the area too) for doing that to me. ;-) WHY I OUGHTA!

They make different microphones (see countryman's lavalieres) that will work a lot better with wireless transmitters. Consider an investment that will save headaches, embarrasment, and of course Feedback :)

You don't suck at live sound. Not saying you were a beginer once, but everyone was. Keep working hard, study everything you can about sound, there's alot out there, but don't get discouraged! Keep the enthusiasm! Being positive is half the job, 10% of sound is work, and 40% fun. The sugestions above are spot on too! Please lets avoid a Bose pissing match ;)
 
jokerswild said:
Weddings are not the place for that "Wall of Sound" setup.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah? How long you been in this crazy biz, Rob? ;)

Ceremony, yea. Reception, well... let's say the dancers wanted rafter-rattling bass thump. Get a little liquid motorvation in 'em and they'll party hardy. The bride said turn it up, let's get these people to partying. I said Yes, Ma'am and pushed them sliders up three quarters of an inch. That was all it took and the place was shakin' ~ I fished my ear plugs out of the gig bag. Amps were not near max, either. It's headroom, Baby. :D

The Curves Bachelor Auction shows were like that ~ wall-rattling thump and them women got down. The walls of the Dover Sheraton were vibrating throughout the building. We had over 400 that night.

Then there was the Hooters Bikini finals in Rehoboth. The place was packed like sardines, yet this sheer power was needed to get above the roar of the crowd.

That's indoors. We can reach the far field for receptions that are out on the back 40 when it comes to that. It has.

I agree that the majority of wedding shows don't require the stacks. I'm just sayin'... I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. We can always turn it down and still have a decent tone.

We have it. And we didn't pay 5 grand for it. :)
 
I'm gonna go with the mic. I use a "1 inch" mic ( In other words a mic that has to be held an inch or less from the mouth ) for SPEAKING ( not singing) purposes. I can literally point the thing at a speaker a foot away with no feedback.

Believe it or not, good examples are the Gemini UHFs. Really crummy for singing, but work very well for announcing.
 
Precisionpower said:
Oh really??

I Have a very large wedding coming up next March. 750 people.

You really think a L1 & B1 set up will cover that amount of people?? :sqlaugh:

For small get togethers...yes the bose is a very good option...
But, just like the average Mobile Dj trying to do everything with a pair of mackies on sticks, the bose has its limits..

I would not try to attempt 750 people with it. no way in hell.
Click to expand...

Fred Wright said:
Oh yeah? How long you been in this crazy biz, Rob? ;)

Ceremony, yea. Reception, well... let's say the dancers wanted rafter-rattling bass thump. Get a little liquid motorvation in 'em and they'll party hardy. The bride said turn it up, let's get these people to partying. I said Yes, Ma'am and pushed them sliders up three quarters of an inch. That was all it took and the place was shakin' ~ I fished my ear plugs out of the gig bag. Amps were not near max, either. It's headroom, Baby. :D

The Curves Bachelor Auction shows were like that ~ wall-rattling thump and them women got down. The walls of the Dover Sheraton were vibrating throughout the building. We had over 400 that night.

Then there was the Hooters Bikini finals in Rehoboth. The place was packed like sardines, yet this sheer power was needed to get above the roar of the crowd.

That's indoors. We can reach the far field for receptions that are out on the back 40 when it comes to that. It has.

I agree that the majority of wedding shows don't require the stacks. I'm just sayin'... I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. We can always turn it down and still have a decent tone.

We have it. And we didn't pay 5 grand for it. :)
Click to expand...


Guys.... take a chill pill for a moment.... this topic was not about someone trying to produce sound for a huge wedding... heck I don't think he even said he was trying to reproduce live instramentation.... seems that he only had ONE powered Gemini speaker on a stick.... I guaranfrickintee a single L1/2B1 would have sufficed in this instance. No need for a wall of amps and speakers.....

That said a wedding of the magnitude you guys are trying to inject into this convo is way out of the ordinary.... I'm quite positive that a 750 person wedding ceremony much less reception is not going to occure on a regular basis.

Further that was not the intent of the topic... it was quite simply a case of cheap speaker and possibly a mic gain issue.... for which a higher quality speaker and or processing system probably would have remedied it... and I jokingly said that a Bose system would have solved the problem....

I never said it would serve for a freaking rock concert.
 
Guys....mine is bigger than all of ya'lls....now can we get back on the topic?

He stated he had trouble with the lavs....not hand helds, so operator error in positioning probably isn't the issue (I'm *assuming* they were pinned, not handed a lapel to pin themselves). Feedback is caused, as Joker said, by the mic picking up the output of the speaker. Causes?

Mic...an omni lav is more difficult to get higher gain before feedback, but gives you the flexibility of picking up a small area rather than 1 individual. We use all uni lavs for this reason; we can control what they pick up and get the most out of them.

Speakers affect feedback only in that they are the ones putting out the sound. Some speakers put a lot of sound off the back of the cabinet, so the more you toe them out to get the drivers pointed away from the mic, the more feedback you create.

Processing does not cause feedback, but may not give you the tools to eliminate it while still maintaining a good level of intelligibility to the audience.

If you don't know how to eliminate feedback, you need to learn. It's a basic process that takes a few minutes of intentionally creating feedback. You can do a better job with a 31 band eq or a Feedback Destroyer than with a 5 or 7 band on a little mixer. It's all about having the tools and maximizing what you have. It shouldn't usually involve a new system (however you might be able to improve with a few components).

ok, back to your match gentlemen!
 
Thanks Val you can come out and play anytime I know you have tons more thoughts and no one will argue the point with the Queen of Boom!!!
 
If you have to use inexpesnive gear for live sound, then it works best if you move your speaker REALLY far away and turn it up louder to disperse the sound over the area rather than direct it right to the listeners.

Lavaliers are tough in live sound becuase they are generally designed for TV and video recording where there is no FOH or monitor to cause feedback.

Put your main speaker well behind the audience so that it is as far away as possible from the mics. Turn it up louder to spray over the area. If you need fill down front, use one or two speakers but turn them way down so that it simply gives presence and articulation to the sound coming from the louder main.

Wind is a pain with lavaliers. A wind screen can even make the noise worse because it increases the profile of the mic (more surface area).
The best you can do in a windy outdoor situation is to put the mic on the person whose back will be turned to wind most often. For example, if you mic the grrom with his back to the wind - both the officiant and the bride are likley to be facing him when they speak - consequently being picked up by the mic without the added wind noise of two more open mics.

If you have high sound levels off your mics, you can use a gate to cut out wind noise and prevent feedback from open mics when the person is not speaking. This allows you to grab only the sound off the mic in best position at any given time. You can also use gates with an external trigger to mute other mics when a specific mic is in use (like the moderator in a panel discussion.)
 
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