Group Think Censorship?

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Peter would I mind someone coming to critique me, not at all. Who choses the person you, what if I dont like the person you chose. Do I get to then chose someone. This whole arguement you have that I dont know what I dont know is getting a little crazy. Who sets the guidelines for what I or anyone should know? Do you know what perception is Peter. Perception is not right or wrong. But the perception that you give is that if you dont charge a professional fee,your words right, you cant be a professional. You can only be what a hobbyist. Who made that the rule?

You claim that most djs are amerturish at best, but that is your perception based on guidelines that who set? You! You claim that you have testimony from brides/grooms that prove this out, care to share or is this a trade secret.

I'm beginning to think this fulltime/parttime, hobbyist, professional fee is just another ploy to scare brides/grooms that will fail like all the other ploys. You remember them dont you

1. Backup equipement-cant use that one cause djs went and got the equipement
2. Insurance-got that also
3. legal music-all sorts of gray areas for everyone on this topic best to leave it alone
4. etc etc etc

Peter you believe a professional dj should be a certain way, I and many others see a professional dj in a different way. Yet you come in and claim we are not professionals, again by whos standard, last I heard we really dont have any hard clear cut standards in the dj profession.

Peter a scary thought, I turn 48 next week and that means that I have been in one form of customer relations now for 33 years. I will run my business the way I see fit. Earn an income that supports me and my family all the while serving my customers with outstanding service, based on my customers not what you or anyone has to say. I have never nor will I ever need to have more than what I truly need in life or have right now. Im content in my life knowing that I tell the customer I'll do something and then go out and beat that expectation they have.

Thats it for now been fun but I think its time to move on.
 
Peter Merry said:
”I don’t care about making a living…I’m happy and feel good about my price and that’s all that matter…and oh yeah…by they way…I’m also just as good as the full-time professionals.
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Are you a full time DJ?

Last I read you are a Public Speaker, Wedding Planner, Author and God knows what else. With all this going on how could you possibly be a fulltime DJ

Now that being said....

Peter Merry said:
Give me just one example...quote away. Please by all means...give just me one exmaple of having done this.
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Do you not slag people with 9 to 5 jobs for being part time DJs? Meanwhile you are trapseing all over the country hawking books and putting on seminars all the while claiming to be a fulltime DJ. Do you not derive an income from this or are you doing it out of the goodness of your heart? If you get an income from this its a job and according to the rules of Merry you arent fulltime

Thats just one example off the top of my head


Peter Merry said:
”Have to be? Which ones? Where are you? Your web site has your phone number…but no area code? There is no mention of you market on your site as well. But I’m afraid pointing that out might be deemed unfair and to comply with this community’s group think I should be expected to just respect you as the equally professional entertainer that you are? Frankly…based on your site…I can see why you might be doing weddings that are only $5,000 for entire event…and that’s okay…there will be always be a market for bargain basement anything. However…with no idea what kind of market you are in…I have to ask the following: Do people own home in your market? Do they drive cars? Are any of those cars Mercedes Benz? Are there any country clubs? Or is the family fun center putt-putt course the only option for golfers if your market?

The point is this…I know may DJs in “small” markets who are getting $2,000 and even more…and are able to make a full-time living as DJs. Most of them have an area code and service location on their web sites as well.
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I live in the 902 area code. I serve Eastern Nova Scotia

Ive done weddings that were $50,000+ and ones where I was the biggest expense

Ive been doing this 24 years this October....22 of them without ever hearing the name Peter Mery

Sure people own thier own homes....You can pick up a pretty fancy one here for about $100,000. Theres a few Mercedes but alot more GM and we have a predominatly older population

I am the only DJ in my market with a website...It sure aint fancy but it works. Got to fix it up one of these days

We happen to have several golf courses in the area I serve. Actually one of them is in the top 100 in the world http://www.highlandslinksgolf.com/awards.html

I dont find alot of international golfers get married here and most locals dont choose it either. I have been referred by them a couple of times though

If you are not too busy doing whatever it is you do you should invite a few of these $2000 small market DJs here I would love to hear from them and get thier slant on things

And if you ever decide to come here golfing the first rounds on me:sqwink:
 
DJCraziAce said:
this argument seems to have NO point.
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I agree that there is NO point in THIS argument.

Hey, did you get my PM? If not, then please let me know.

Thanks.

:)
 
DJCraziAce said:
You know... this argument seems to have NO point. What exactly are you arguing about? I smell jealousy... 'tis all.
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Yup you are right Arnoldo there is no point

Jealousy...Not a bit. I hope Mr Merry continues do do well for himself

I do have an issue with hipocrasy. Theres an old adage when you live in a glass house you shouldnt throw stones.. Theres been a few broken windows in this thread

Its all good though when the book comes out and all us heathen borromfeeders buy it Mr Merry will go back in to the woodwork until the next thing thats better than sliced bread comes along

Mabye ill write a book "102 ways to scare a bride to your way of thinking"

Im sure it will be a best seller
 
Scott Susor~

I know you are anxious to spar with me...it's been far too long hasn't it?

However...wait your turn...I am still responding to posts from 2 days ago.

I'll respond to you when I get caught up...until then...try to quit acting like Arnold Horshack.
 
Peter Merry said:
I am still responding to posts from 2 days ago.
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...not to mine, though. :sqfrown:

And I LOVE you, man! Really, because our "group think" is all one big thought of love; plus, I promised King Durio & His Hermits.

May I please ask you to respect the fact that I am happy with what little I have? What makes me feel extra special about this is: when I do my little humanitarian things, the ratio between what I have and what I give back to the world is smaller than that of somebody who has millions of dollars and just gives money to charity as if it were pocket change.

And, no, I am not insinuating anything about YOU.

Love and riches (in a non-monetary format),
-Johnny
 
DJMN~

Where do I start with you? Let’s try this approach…I want to read this quote from your post…but let’s pretend that it was written by one of your cheaper competitors.

I get calls from several couples looking for a DJ.....and the top DJ markets basic rates start at $700. Yea basic rate...........ok this is where I divide and get my point across..........and we still all be friends.....

So I say to myself..............WHAT IN THE F&&K DO THEY HAVE THAT JUSTIFIES THEIR PRICE FOR A "BASIC" PACKAGE!! They arent that great!!!!!

They have been in the business for around 20 yrs, but it doesnt mean anything in this area anymore! They have got overpriced, and for the short time...until me (thank god)....there has really been no competition!

That dj market is about to start shrinking as I get my hands in the market. I know they are already seeing a "hit" in their pocketbooks, because mine is filling.

I charge $300 and I am extremely happy with these prices. I almost feel as I am ripping the client off. Although people remind me, that I offer just as much as any other DJ, and I perform to the highest standards. BECAUSE I AM A++++++ GENUINE WITH MY CLIENTS!!!

I work full time at McDonalds...making 9..something an hour. I go to my weekend warrior job, and I pull home more money in one night of work, than I did all week. You do the math. Less hours....more pay...hmmmm...whats wrong with this picture....NOTHING!! I'm getting paid, and my business is building!

So lets just say......I start cleaning the market, and my referrals are off the wall, and the MARKET IS MINE. Do I charge the prices that the high DJ is charging now...........NO........THAT MAKES ME JUST AS BAD AS THEM!!
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Get the picture? Any arguments for this fictional lowballer who is undercutting you? I’m sure he does the same things you do…just cheaper right?

I'm charging what I am comfortable with, and I classify myself as professional, because I treat it that way!!
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A professional wouldn’t keep his price low due to feelings of guilt. Those are signs of low self-confidence…and a complete lack of a business plan. Did I mention that professionals (those who make this their profession) have business plans to help determine their pricing? This isn’t the Death Star trench…you are not Luke Skywalker…and when it comes to your business…the last thing you should be doing when it comes to setting a fair price is listening to that voice in your head that keeps saying “Let go Luke…trust your feelings.”

I know my math, and I have seen all kinds of formulas. But I also can figure if I did 40 $700 weddings.....that puts me in the $28,000 range. Which is about what I make all year at my full time job. Now figure on average I spend 10 hours on each wedding multiplied by 40 is 400 hours. Which accumulates to 2 and a half 40 hour weeks. Whats so wrong with that??
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Was that high school math…or college math? How about business math? Is that annual $28,000 you get from your full time job…take home pay? Does your boss make you pay self-employment taxes…even though he’s the business owner? Do you have to pay for the office space, utilities, and other business expenses that keep your day job available? It’s common knowledge that replacing the income and benefits provided by a $28,000 a year full-time job when attempting to match the same take-home salary and benefits with your own business will require nearly 3 times as much gross annual revenue to cover the added costs of doing business and self-employment taxes.

Just to help you with the math…that would mean you’d need to gross about $84,000 a year…just to keep the same $28,000 take home salary + benefits.

$84,000 a year is 120 jobs at $700...not 40…which means you would need to work every Saturday and Sunday and few Friday nights.

Now…what if you went to a counselor to resolve your guilt issues…and raised your rates to $1,200 and only held out for the jobs that would pay. You’d be a lot closer to being able to go full time if the need ever arose wouldn’t you.

I didnt have my full time job.........I would be happy doing less work...more money...more time for family during the week!
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120 events year at $700 won’t give much free time at all with you family…will it? But 70 events a year at $1,200 would be little easier to manage.
 
Once Again

Peter Merry said:
A professional wouldn’t keep his price low due to feelings of guilt.
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Thank you for showing us your mastery of what a "professional" is and does. I'll have Oxford call you so the dictionary entry can be updated. Okay, I'm just kidding.

Why are you trying to change our value systems? Are we not allowed to have our own?

If not, then I apologise in advance for going against your grain.
 
Final Thought Before I Fall Asleep

Some of you guys set your sets WAY to low.

$2 000? Bah!

I ask for $1 million. Yes, I set my goals very high.

Being seasoned in marketing, I sucker them in by posting bottom feeder prices on my site for only the simplest of set ups...then I hit them with the million!

BUT, as a TRUE PROFESSIONAL, I NEGOTIATE with my clients...and end up somewhere between $500 and $1 000.
 
The Vinyl Spinner said:
Some of you guys set your sets WAY to low.

$2 000? Bah!

I ask for $1 million. Yes, I set my goals very high.

BUT, as a TRUE PROFESSIONAL, I NEGOTIATE with my clients...and end up somewhere between $500 and $1 000.
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I think your negotiating skills need work, lol
 
Members... I think it's time to walk away...

"What we have here is a failure to communicate". Folks... our "full time" professional has spent countless hours debating, defending and defaming. I think we aught to let him get back to his busy schedule, so that he can put his efforts into his business and book. Too much time has been wasted here with this debauched debate.

I'm tired of the gauntlet constructed by our overzealous, notorious member. I'd ask members to discontinue this thread conflict and let it die the death it deserves.

And to Peter: As I stated in my welcome to you here only a few days ago: your reputation did, in fact, precede you, and it was corroborated by your conduct here. I truly feel sorry for you and your effort to exalt your self above the rest of us.

My disdain for you has been obvious in some of my posts, and I am disappointed in myself for letting you into my head to take up my time. You commented several days ago that if anyone wanted you to leave, to just ask. I'm asking.
 
DAamn, Not sugar coating that one are we Tyrone? Somethings just need to be said!
 
mp3jrick~

What I'd like to see is 10 of these million dollar djs work their magic in the same 20 square mile depressed area like Camden NJ, then I'd be a believer.
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Is it my imagination…or is Camden, NJ just across the bridge from a little tiny market known as Philadelphia, PA? Population 12,000,000? Are you trying to pull my leg here?


My market in SoCal is all of Southern California…Just last year alone I worked weddings in:

Santa Barbara…150 miles to the Northwest

San Diego…75 miles to the South

Palm Springs…110 miles to the East


“20 square mile depressed area”

Do you not have a vehicle? Do you have to pull your equipment on a cart to each job?

15 minutes from my house you can find a depressed area called Santa Ana...I don’t work there very often.

Why do so many of you say “not in my market” and then draw a boundary line around your block? Try crossing the bridge into Philly…I hear they have great cheese steaks.

Tell me you were joking…
 
DJMN~

DEMAND CONSITUTES HIGHER PRICES!!!!
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Careful...that kind of talk here can get threads closed.:sqwink:

Demand for what? For any DJ? For a good DJ? For a great DJ? For you?

Which one can you actually help to increase through your own efforts?

Is it possible to create enough demand in your market to get $1,200 guilt free?
 
Peter, I am aware that you don't know me at all!

I would like to turn a question you asked around and ask you the same

…are you or have you ever been open to inviting a critique from a Hobbiest (LIKE ME) who has no qualifications to help you identify things that you don't know? If not...Why? Stubborn pride? How much could that be costing you? Perhaps you'll never know?
 
Hank~

Funny video by the way...I rather enjoyed it. I couldn't help wondering how much more you could make if that creativity and humor were applied towards marketing yourself as something more than just "affordable"...but to each his own.

Do you honestly believe that all the lower priced vendors are operating at a loss and don't know any better? Everyone sets their own price for whatever reasons. That's what makes it OUR business and not OTHERS.
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For the gas stations...no.

For DJs? Perhaps...in fact...based on some of the business plans for pricing I have seen just in this thread (I'm happy with it, it works for now, I don't a corporation, I'd feel guilty charging more, etc....just try picturing a gas station owner offering those reasons for their current pricing) I'd say there are probably a large number of DJs how not posting anywhere that don't know any better.

But the problem with your gas stations...is they aren't typically owned by a full time accountant who just owns a gas station on the side. In toehr words...the gas station owners are all making a profit...and are most likely doing so as their profession.

That's certainly not the case with most DJs.
 
Proformance~

You quoted me saying...

But complaining to the teacher so you won't have to be exposed to ideas that might be too challenging...??? What is this...3rd Grade?
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And then responded to me with...

But give the group thinkers some credit.

Nothing in your resume qualifies you as a teacher. You're a DJ.
Group your thoughts however you wish, they have no more authority than the group you are addressing.
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Please re-read my comments...I was not assuming the role of teacher...the teacher was however felt compelled to lock my thread due to my "fellow students" whining and complaining about my point of view.

As for my qualifications...I never asserted that I was the teacher...but I may be qualified in many areas of which you are most likely unaware. What of it?
 
dogman~

Peter would I mind someone coming to critique me, not at all. Who choses the person you, what if I dont like the person you chose. Do I get to then chose someone.
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Once again...stop inserting me into the issue. I do not want to critique you...and I have no desire to choose who should. I was only aksing if you were open to seeking such a critique from a trusted mentor (any trusted mentor).

If you have never done it (and based on our conversation...I'm assuming that would be a no), let me encourage you to seriously give it some thought. It can be a valuable tool for any performer at any stage to seek out and get such performance critiques.

Peter you believe a professional dj should be a certain way, I and many others see a professional dj in a different way. Yet you come in and claim we are not professionals, again by whose standard, last I heard we really dont have any hard clear cut standards in the dj profession.
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No...let me be clear...I believe that a clear cut professional standard needs to be established. But I also believe that in order for such a standard to be taken seriously by the public at large...the standard should first be set and agreed upon by those who have already made this their profession. That may sound egotistical at first...but think it through for a moment...

If the "professional standard" is determined by those who have not yet been able to make being a DJ their profession, or by those who have no real desire to ever make it their profession, then the overall consensus will lean towards a definition that includes even the lowest of common denominators.

This is why for years...the definitions and descriptions of a "professional" that were promoted the loudest were:

A: Wears a Tuxedo
B: Has a Cordless Mic
C: Has Pro PA Equipment

...and so on...because the bar had been set low so most DJs could and would qualify.

But the public already expects us to be dressed properly and have the necessary equipment to get the job done right...and they have seen countless DJs who met these minimalist standards...but still ruined the party with crude jokes about their 3 ex-wives, or by getting tipsy at the open bar, or by forgetting the Bride & Groom's names during the Grand Entrance announcement and then saying "F*** it! Who cares anyway?" (Ture story)

As more DJs began to realize that these minimalsit standards weren't enough, they raised the bar and added on definitions that included MC skills and no drinking. (Believe it or not..many DJs in Cananda are still arguing for their "right" to enjoy the open bar!). The problem that has occured is that until now, the general populous being a majority of sideline DJs didn't want that bar raised too high thus leaving them out from the definition of what it means to be a professional DJ. So we just keep playing professionalism limbo.

One of the best choices I ever made in my career was seeking out established, full time professionals that I could mentor with as I wanted this to be my career...and I didn't think seeking advice on how to do that from those who never had...and might never care to do...would be much help.

So...what if (and this is big what if)...you all surrendered on this issue and gave the DJs who have made this their profession, their primary (not only...just primary) source of income, their livelihood per se...the unfettered opportunity to clearly define what makes one a professional DJ in terms of service and performance? If that benchmark could be set in a clear way that not only sets the bar high, but also sets it fairly...and was agreed upon by said "professional" DJs...wouldn't it seem logical that then, with a clear marker in place, even part-time DJs could measure themselves against that marker and say "I am offering professional level of service?" Wouldn't that carry a lot more weight and credibility with the public than saying..."we all just make up whatever defintion makes us happy?"

Imagine with me for just a moment...that I somehow landed an interivew on the Oprah Show to promote my book for brides...and she asked me what the markers were for a professional wedding entertainer.

Which answer would you rather hear me give on national TV?

"Oprah, the professional wedding entertainer will always provide a high level of service and performance in these 7 areas...(followed by 7 bullet point items)...and here are 7 things you, the bride, can do to verify that they are currently offering a professional level of service and performance."

...or...

"Oprah, your guess is as good as mine. Every DJ is different and they all have their own definitions of what it takes to be a professional...and each of those definitions are equally valid."

Which one would the public take seriously? Which one would they discard as lacking any credibility?
 
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