Ethics in IRC Chat Rooms

[jokerswild]

IRC chat rooms are great in that you can chat with your buddies and even trade files and pictures of each other doing goofy things.... but when does it go to far?

Is it ethical to expect to be able to trade such things as copyrighted materials such as karaoke or other forms of music & video....

I would think the answer would be: NOT ONLY NO BUY H.E.L.L. NO... but the more time I spend in IRC chats the more it becomes apparent the folks just don't give a shetz....

Thoughts?

 

[toqer]

You know my stance on this... Strictly anti pirate. It's not just a moral choice, it's a business choice too (Why in the world would I want to help out my competition by giving them my library?)

That guy was brazen enough to ask me here. He should have done his homework because now he's going to lose his business. You don't ask the guy with the strongest anti-piracy message on his softwares home page. Nor should you ask the guy who created a graph comparing karaoke sales to the rise of piracy in newsgroups. It's probably a REALLY REALLY REALLY stupid idea to ask the guy who's a good personal friend of Chris Cofoni of MMOgroup.

Anyways, I dug up info on this guy, forwarded it to the powers that be at MMogroup. I've been told "Thanks toqer!" He's going to get shut down soon enough, which will be one less illegitimate competitor in his area.

(PS Jon Tuck, I did like you said and anonymized this post, so plz don't delete it)

 

[Guest]

Rob, sorry for the short hi-jack...

Toqer, I have to hand it to you. You have been a very strong anti-piracy voice in the karaoke community.

I saw that anti-piracy statement before. It gave me pause to double-check my library and the libraries of my partners. We found some missing CDGs but, rather than removing them we just replaced the CDG. I don't know how they went missing but I wasn't worried about it as long as I can still get the CDG.

When I told your our CDG size you took me to task indicating how long it would take to rip them all and you're right about the time. Fortunately, when I and my partners got together we all had lists of the individual CDGs we had and could tie the ripped version back to the CDG disc. From there we were simply able to determine where each of us had CDG holes and go out and purchase those. Why rip when you don't have to but make sure you have a legal copy.

Now, I don't carry all of them to each karaoke gig but if the authorities want to check, we have each KJ's CDG library in a common storage area and we'd be glad to set up an appointment for them to come and look.

 

[jokerswild]

Very good point and I don't mind the minor hijack.....

If you can prove ownership of your music via sales reciept, actual disc (no matter the condition) you have nothing to worry about...

It's the folks that openly trade via IRC networks and other p2p sources that should be shaking in their boots.... will they get caught? Probably not... but the ones bold enough to post questions such as what toqer got are either ignorant about what it is they are asking for or just don't give a rats arse... either way it's wrong and they just stepped in the proverbial crap pile.

 

[toqer]

You know what's weird GNDJ?

I've shown folks there are other ways to compete outside of the "I HAVE 1251261616 SONGS" penis measuring contest. Beyond that, i've been nice enough to document everything we've done, and give the software out for free.

They still don't get it though...

I might as well announce early the reward i'm getting for all my hard work (since none of the 7b customers hang out here) Last thursday the owner of 7b offered me the bar for a steal of a price, and he's going to finance me himself. Now who said good guys finish last?

 

[Jon Tuck]

Toqer Im busy making arrangements for my Fathers Memorial service sorry I didnt get you the requested proof of a Rat in the cellar. I can say this atleast one member here will regret their actions. Thanks for being one who is adamant about proper library issues. If I get a chance tonight I will attempt the screen shot and send it over to you. Im gone until Monday. Please forgive my less than humble services.
SOMEONE WILL REGRET that they had the brazen cahones to ask you to go against your fight to rid Piracy from the industry. kudos to you Mr Toqer.

 

[jokerswild]

See when I offered to member's here to help them out by ripping their discs properly was purely a gesture to help out those that had helped me out in the past. I would in no way shape or form keep copies of material that I don't already own... Plus I was testing the waters to see if there was a need for such a service and if there were then I would have started charging but since most here seem able to get it done them selves I don't see a market for a CDG conversion service....

 

[Guest]

I really don't get it. If you an illegal library just go buy the CDGs and get legit. There might even be a way to make a deal with a local CDG vendor.

When my partners and I combined libraries we took the list we compiled to a local shop that sells CDGs and presented it to them. They cut us a break on the price and we all had the library.

Sure, it was still a big outlay but legitimacy has its price.

So now we buy four copies of each PHM, rip one set, and copy it to each of the systems.

 

[toqer]

I really don't get it. If you an illegal library just go buy the CDGs and get legit. There might even be a way to make a deal with a local CDG vendor.

Screw the local vendor. If you ever need anything MMOGroup (sdk, ps, jtg, etc) Chris Cofoni and Steve Rose said they'll give nice fat discounts for any autokdj user buying in bulk.

 

[Fred Wright]

Thing is, there are those magic words: "Buy", "Pay" and "Work". People who steal do so because they can. They'd rather steal than buy, pay or work.

There is no honor among thieves.

 

[Jon Tuck]

funny thing is a thief has no certain look. In fact those you'd least likely want to believe would be deep in the middle of such Sin are doing it openly from one forum to another.

 

[Precisionpower]

I'm glad i didn't have to get that 6 page PM from Toqer!!!

 

[jokerswild]

I'm glad i didn't have to get that 6 page PM from Toqer!!!

Never, pirate music especially karaoke and the hackles will stay down and your safe....

That's how it should be... but, we all know pirates will be pirates and even with easier more affordable digital distribution channels the pirates that want to pirate will still pirate. At least with digital rights becoming more and more prevelant and less of an enigma it does make it easier for legit KJ's to stay legit and let be able to compete with the pirates.

 

[Guest]

Screw the local vendor. If you ever need anything MMOGroup (sdk, ps, jtg, etc) Chris Cofoni and Steve Rose said they'll give nice fat discounts for any autokdj user buying in bulk.

Toqer:

That's nice to know; howver, we're using VDJ and PCDJ. But, bulk is bulk. You know these guys better than I, will they cut the same deal?

Right now we're looking at four dup sets, one per rig, of PHM to keep current. With after prom season hitting, we'll be doing lots with kids that will want the latest in karaoke. Can MMO cut a deal on something like that?

BTW, we are taking a strong look at autokdj. Three partners already have steady weekday KJ gigs and I am just getting back into it so all the bells and whistles you have built in for rotation is looking better and better to us.

 

[jokerswild]

Toqer:

That's nice to know; howver, we're using VDJ and PCDJ. But, bulk is bulk. You know these guys better than I, will they cut the same deal?

Right now we're looking at four dup sets, one per rig, of PHM to keep current. With after prom season hitting, we'll be doing lots with kids that will want the latest in karaoke. Can MMO cut a deal on something like that?

BTW, we are taking a strong look at autokdj. Three partners already have steady weekday KJ gigs and I am just getting back into it so all the bells and whistles you have built in for rotation is looking better and better to us.

Young Padawon, you must let go of your physical self and allow the AutOKdj force flow through and around you... let go of your old KJ habits and allow the power of the AutOKdj take control....

That for most traditional and even digital KJ's is the hardest thing to do... allow a program to take total control of rotation.... but loosen your grip on that pad of paper and singer's slips and you'll be surprised at how well it will manage your night.

 

[Guest]

Okay Master Yoda, I mean Rob...

Seriously, that is what we're thinking. The only problem right now is that the smoking ban caused a down spike in attendance that is only now starting to correct. This caused the rotations to get skewed; that is, we really haven't been seeing the same people consitently since February. And we are also seeing some new people that have to be trained in rotation etiquette.

Once we get to a point where we have some consistent regulars I think we'll be ready to bring in the automation.

 

[jokerswild]

Okay Master Yoda, I mean Rob...

Seriously, that is what we're thinking. The only problem right now is that the smoking ban caused a down spike in attendance that is only now starting to correct. This caused the rotations to get skewed; that is, we really haven't been seeing the same people consitently since February. And we are also seeing some new people that have to be trained in rotation etiquette.

Once we get to a point where we have some consistent regulars I think we'll be ready to bring in the automation.

And that is the hard part.... folks today are all about instant gratification and don't understand that with karaoke you have to wait your turn... sooooo many times I see "Mic Hogs" or "Sing Duets" even if a duet isn't requested types.

I saw the later at a recent show I attended and the KJ did nothing, absolutely nothing to discourage the "Phantom Dueter". This lady took it upon herself to "help" almost every singer and or go up and sing for those that had been put in rotation by someone else and then decide to not sing she'd come up and do it for them.... really annoying

Oops we went a little off topic....

 

[Guest]

Oops we went a little off topic....

Rob:

This is your thread. You have that right.

I kind of skewed it as well.