Furman on speakers

jaswrx

DJ Extraordinaire
Feb 15, 2015
239
33
I recently met another DJ who was raving about his Furman AC-215 that he keeps in his coffin. He doesn't use this on his powered speakers, but basically everything else (mixer, computer, controller, etc. etc.).

He truly believes it sounds quieter and less noise gets in the system, and he claims that if he disconnects it at a venue, and goes with a normal power strip instead it sounds noisy. I did some research and found a great video from Ben at NLFX. I guess these things do something...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ry30HbJblg



Is there actually more harm than good by plugging in the latest generation of powered speakers in it as well?

https://www.amazon.com/Furman-AC-215A-Conditioner-Auto-Resetting-Protection/dp/B003PJ6NPO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1548967244&sr=8-1&keywords=AC-215a


I currently don't use anything, except a triple outlet power cord. I keep a strip in my coffin which powers a lot, which leads down to under the table where my two powered speakers connect (hinting 3 outlets).
 

steve149

Veni, Vidi, Lusi
Staff member
Sep 26, 2011
33,687
Prospect, CT
There should be NO harm, assuming the unit doesn't limit current. The one you link to lists 10A as the max, which is probably fine for most systems run at a normal level. Heavy use of bass (live drums, synth, bass, etc) with a large sub could certainly pull more than that unit can supply.
 
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jaswrx

DJ Extraordinaire
Feb 15, 2015
239
33
I will take the one that is less than 5 pounds. haha.

I am trying to see if I can get a hold of the older one which is 15amps. Seems to be EXACTLY the same. (AC-215 vs newer AC-215A)
 

jaswrx

DJ Extraordinaire
Feb 15, 2015
239
33
I was looking at that, but that doesn't do anything for cleaning the power noise up.

Probably good for ground loop or humming issues related to audio chain.
 

jaswrx

DJ Extraordinaire
Feb 15, 2015
239
33
Those are NOT doing much since they don't offer the advanced filtering as Furman calls Lift (Linear Filtering Technology)--

Linear Filtration Technology | Furman Power | Purifying power for over 40 years. - (http://www.furmanpower.com/furman-technologies/linear-filtration-technology)


Or the advanced SMP (Series Multi-Stage Protection Plus) and they are priced accordingly.
Series Multi-Stage Protection [SMP] | Furman Power | Purifying power for over 40 years. - (https://www.furmanpower.com/series-multi-stage-protection-smp)

Basically, the one I am looking into features the same tech found in their upper-end units now known as the Classic, Series, but packs it all in a small compact unit.

I might have found the older unit from the mid 2000s, that does 15 amps. If so, it's a hell of a deal at $125.
 
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Handinon

DJ Extraordinaire
Oct 1, 2014
2,079
72
I still remain skeptical of the "magic black boxes". Here's it's insides -

Gurman.jpg

If your friend is using simple, old style, transformer type wall warts to power some of his equipment, it is possible that it could reduce the noise floor. However, anything with a modern switching power supply like your laptop or controller? Phooey!
 

TES3S

DJ Extraordinaire
Sep 18, 2016
184
Los Angeles, CA
I was skeptical at first, but after watching a few videos, it clearly is helping/doing something more than a simple power box.

There are even some trusted users on youtube that use a similar type of device, claiming their sound is better at louder volumes too. Who knows.

Did you watch NLFX's video?
 

DJ Ricky B

DJ Extraordinaire
Mar 9, 2015
3,901
37
Ben stated in the video that these power conditioners do not FIX the issue of a HUM.

I guess it is a common mis conception that power conditioners fix that issue. I have had many DJs tell me, that is what the power conditioner is for in the past.

With that said, I always have used higher end Surge protectors to plug everything into. Never purchased a power conditioner.

I have had a FEW instances where I had a hum in my system. About half the time, the issue was a bad patch cable...Usually a TRS 1/4 inch Mic Cable that was going bad. Changed out the cable, and the issue is fixed. ...A FEW times I had a hum, and those times it was simply the outlet I was plugged into. Changing the outlet fixed the problem. Usually those times it occured at an older venue.

One one of my Numark CD Mix 2 units, I think the pre amp went bad in the RCA connection on deck 2. I just couldn't use that one RCA connection because if I did, I would get a terrible sounding hum on that channel. Other RCA connections were all fine though. That is like a 15 year old unit which I keep in storage.

So my question is, if the power conditioners don't fix a hum, then what is really the point of using the conditioner? Just a lot of extra surge protection to protect your equipment?
 

TES3S

DJ Extraordinaire
Sep 18, 2016
184
Los Angeles, CA
No one is talking about hum here. That is another thread. Wait, Rickyryan was, but yes, it's clear that conditioners do not deal with that as that is generally ground loop related.

If you watch the video, Ben explains how contaminated the power is. The point of a really good power conditioner is it cleans up the noise, to almost nothing. The Classic series and the compact AC215 used advanced filtering not found on the basic conditioners, and the SMP part is not conditioning, it's just very advanced protection that can take a lot of beating, unlike MOVs. This unit also have extreme voltage protection.
 

Handinon

DJ Extraordinaire
Oct 1, 2014
2,079
72
The point of a really good power conditioner is it cleans up the noise, to almost nothing.
Yes it does, and feeds the "clean power" into your laptop, controller, whatever, that has a switching power supply, which adds noise right back in. To remove the noise a switching power supply adds, they all have filters on their outputs that are exactly the same as what's in that "magic black box". Here's a picture of one -

switchingpowersupply.jpgDo you see the two Toroids? One is part of the "switching power supply", the other is part of a filtering network on the power supplies output - to remove noise - just like the toroidal in the Furman. Thus, an unnecessary redundancy, unless you're prone to wearing a belt and suspenders at the same time.
 

DJ Ricky B

DJ Extraordinaire
Mar 9, 2015
3,901
37
No one is talking about hum here. That is another thread. Wait, Rickyryan was, but yes, it's clear that conditioners do not deal with that as that is generally ground loop related.

If you watch the video, Ben explains how contaminated the power is. The point of a really good power conditioner is it cleans up the noise, to almost nothing. The Classic series and the compact AC215 used advanced filtering not found on the basic conditioners, and the SMP part is not conditioning, it's just very advanced protection that can take a lot of beating, unlike MOVs. This unit also have extreme voltage protection.
I watchd the video, and it's cool that there is no noise on that particular outlet in the video when the higher end power conitioner is plugged in compared to the basic power strip. However, how many outlet's dowe encounter will have "poor quality" power?

Plugged into a thousands of outlets. If my surge protector says it is grounded, and I'm not getting any hum issues, then why do I need a power conditioner? What performance is it giving me? What is the benefit besides "additional" protection past what a good surge protector gives? Is using a power conditioner essentially just for piece of mind for those who really want to ensure their equipment is safe?
 

TES3S

DJ Extraordinaire
Sep 18, 2016
184
Los Angeles, CA
Actually, most power is that dirty (at least in the US). Supposedly, the benefit is ultra clean power (nothing to do with hum), no noise, and better sound + ultra protection in case of a disaster.

Handinon, do you think Ben is full of it? He is part of the DJ community and I trust what he says. He is mainly stating that it is beneficial on mixers, mic receivers, dmx boards, accessories, etc. I am not sure if he even mentions laptops.

I would think Furman is aware that many things have switching power supplies including TVs, which is one of the most widely used pieces that is plugged into the Furman. I think the point is that the Furman filters power in a linear fashion, unlike the one in our laptops. Even if some equipment has filters, they are not the exact same type found in the Furman.

I watched a few videos online from trusted audio reviewers, and they say the sound (at least when turned up) flat out sounds better and is quite noticeable. Most of them are not using the Furman model, but a conditioner that uses linear filtering.

Not so sure it would be noticed on our DJ speakers, but interesting for sure!
 
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DJ Ricky B

DJ Extraordinaire
Mar 9, 2015
3,901
37
Yeah, so I am about 100% SURE that many DJs bought Furman Power Conditioners in the past believing they are a component you purchase in order to get rid of HUM, and ensure CLEAN Power. I think a lot of purchasers had the mis conception that HUM was created by bad power coming from the venue's power outlet, and a Power Conditioner eliminates that. ...I am positive that is the primary reason these conditioners have been purchased by many in the past.

I have had A LOT of other DJs, and even sound guys recommending furman power conditioners to me...Most of the time the issue was never brought up. I rarely dealt with a ground hum. It's just when they noticed that I was not using one, they would instantly say that I should go and buy one because they would eliminate HUM, and clean the power up in case I ecounter it.

LOL

I always scratched my head at that, and never dove into buying one. I just figured a good surge protector should be enough. for what I set up.
 

TES3S

DJ Extraordinaire
Sep 18, 2016
184
Los Angeles, CA
well, I for one would never think it would get rid of hum, and they do NOT advertise that whatsoever.

Not sure why anyone would even think such a thing.

Regarding "good surge protector," that is a different feature of this unit, and from what I have seen, most DJs using strip surge protectors are fooling themselves thinking it would even protect their equipment which I why I have never used one. A good surge protector is not cheap. There are many things that make a surge protector worth more than the basic one. Mainly, the amount of joules...