Doing a Sorority formal - think I'll use their sound system

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Unless it's totally distorited most people are not going to say anything as long as you are playing the right tunes.

Sound was okay, and I feel I played the right material. Honestly, they got a deal, $1200 for photographer, DJ and photobooth for 2 hours. Like you described, the Bose sound is good for a lot of things but those subs delivered a lot less than I was expecting. Frankly, my Alto 15" subs are less than my old Yorkville, but they put out a TON more thump than those F1s did. Not sure if it was a problem with the setup but I doubt it. It was much the same tone as I've seen with my L1 rig. The L1 also had the lack of air on top, but I was able to overcome the thump by using my LS801ps. THAT is an awesome combination. In hindsight, I'd do exactly the same thing over again. I didn't have to setup my facade/table and I didn't have to setup my sound rig. The F1 was adequate, but still under-whelming to what I was anticipating. No disrespect to Bose. I like them and it's still the only name brand that brides have ever been able to identify with. Still the Altos with K10s on top absolutely, positively kills that F1 rig.
 
Unless it's totally distorited most people are not going to say anything as long as you are playing the right tunes.


Which is why unless a DJ is doing BIG events on the routine, there is no need to purchase speakers and subs that are at a higher price point/higher end perceived line up than Alto TS, EV ZLX, Yamaha DBR, or JBL EON speakers. :)
 
People not saying anything vs actually hearing a difference are two completely separate points. This is kinda like saying turning on and off a flashlight is better than buying professional grade lighting because most people won't say anything. There is a reason that cheap products are cheap.
 
People not saying anything vs actually hearing a difference are two completely separate points. This is kinda like saying turning on and off a flashlight is better than buying professional grade lighting because most people won't say anything. These better brands often give you more product for your value. There is a reason that cheap products are cheap.

While I agree with you I got to say the average listener isn't going to notice a difference in 2 different venues on 2 different days unless one is particularly bad.

Also I suspect that the average person doesn't go to a lot of events in the run of a year where there is a DJ. Most 1 some 2 or 3 very few more than that
 
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People not saying anything vs actually hearing a difference are two completely separate points. This is kinda like saying turning on and off a flashlight is better than buying professional grade lighting because most people won't say anything. There is a reason that cheap products are cheap.


Yeah, we have seen this conversation plenty of times. You get what you pay for, warranty, better parts, last longer etc. etc.

It does not change the fact that owning all RCF, FBT, or BOSE F1, or Mayers, or DB TECH will have ZERO effect on the client's decision making process in who they book. Also, I get compliments on having a nice sounding system quite often, and I use Alto TS.

My Bose S1 has had a number of compliments as well from people. It's great for ceremonies, and cocktail hour.

My brother uses a pair of Alto TS110A at all his events. He get's 5 star reviews. ...He hardly ever uses a SUB...and only when he has a big wedding or event. He borrows my 12 inch sub. ...Like once a year.

My sister uses a pair of passive Yamaha SX-12s with a amp. Those speakers are what I were using 15 years ago. She still uses them. She get's 5 star reviews. Those pair of speakers cost like $650 in 1997 or 1998. Still being used on gigs. Those speakers have been used on more than 650 events probably. Cost on usage per event is less tahn $1 on those 2 speakers at this point LOL.


Just saying. Higher end/Higher cost speakers are not a necessity for DJs (Unless you do large events and need the firepower).
 
While I agree with you I got to say the average listener isn't going to notice a difference in 2 different venues on 2 different days unless one is particularly bad.

Also I suspect that the average person doesn't go to a lot of events in the run of a year where there is a DJ. Most 1 some 2 or 3 very few more than that
I don't agree or disagree. While we listen 'better', people are listening. That aside, there is something to be said about the reputation of a company - and of the users of those products.

The Alto TS312 has been out for a bit now - allegedly many reports of problems with it (blown drivers) - and as you know, it happens when you least want it to - in the middle of a show. I am in no way saying that this cannot happen to other speakers. I am saying that by buying from a company with a long reputation of making quality products, the chance of it happening is less. Obviously if you're buying the bottom of the barrel stuff from any company, you can expect issues.

Let's compare this to other things though. A knife is a knife, right? If Outback bought the cheapest of cheap steak knives - do you think the customers would be happy? I'm sure they won't complain as well. I am in now way saying people should buy luxury $8,000 speakers. I am saying that in a market where we are trying to make more than the cheap guys, we shouldn't be buying the cheapest things. Rule #1 is in effect.

You could make a similar comparison in many product/service categories:

The $7 chef’s knife with the hollow handle that presents a struggle with every meal vs. the quality $35 one that seems effortless.
The $20 backpack with poor stitching and no padding that falls apart after a year vs. the quality $75 one that lasts a decade or more and is super comfortable the entire time.
The $1 toothbrush that leaves your teeth feeling grimy vs. the $20 electric toothbrush that makes them feel like you just had a dental cleaning after every brush.
The $500 asphalt driveway that falls apart and needs re-surfacing every 3 years vs. the $2,000 concrete driveway that lasts 3 decades.
The $3 per pound pink slime vs. the $10 grass-fed organic steak.
 
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Yeah, we have seen this conversation plenty of times. You get what you pay for, warranty, better parts, last longer etc. etc.

It does not change the fact that owning all RCF, FBT, or BOSE F1, or Mayers, or DB TECH will have ZERO effect on the client's decision making process in who they book. Also, I get compliments on having a nice sounding system quite often, and I use Alto TS.

My Bose S1 has had a number of compliments as well from people. It's great for ceremonies, and cocktail hour.

My brother uses a pair of Alto TS110A at all his events. He get's 5 star reviews. ...He hardly ever uses a SUB...and only when he has a big wedding or event. He borrows my 12 inch sub. ...Like once a year.

My sister uses a pair of passive Yamaha SX-12s with a amp. Those speakers are what I were using 15 years ago. She still uses them. She get's 5 star reviews. Those pair of speakers cost like $650 in 1997 or 1998. Still being used on gigs. Those speakers have been used on more than 650 events probably. Cost on usage per event is less tahn $1 on those 2 speakers at this point LOL.

Just saying. Higher end/Higher cost speakers are not a necessity for DJs (Unless you do large events and need the firepower).
Funny - many here say that they talk about Bose when they talk to their customers - and their customers are responsive. Better quality speakers are a necessity if you want a better long term ROI.

As for the SX-12's and the cost per usage - over a period of time (the longer, the better) the cost per usage on a much better set would be not very different - and you end up with a much better product. You like to use 5 years as your number for equipment turnover .. so a $300 speaker over 5 years costs you $60/year while an $800 speaker costs you $160/year. Stretch this out to 10 years and you are now at $30/speaker and $80/speaker. 20 years (because you said hers are from 98) and the cost is now $15/speaker and $40/speaker. You are a provider of services and you're not charging bottom of the barrel pricing - don't your customers deserve a better product while giving yourself better components and reliability?
 
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Funny - many here say that they talk about Bose when they talk to their customers - and their customers are responsive. Better quality speakers are a necessity if you want a better long term ROI.

As for the SX-12's and the cost per usage - the cost per usage on a much better set would be not very different.

I agree...My sister should upgrade. She says she wants newer speakers. Been saying that for 5 years, but has not made any purchases. I guess she just continues to use what ain't broken. She does have a single Yamaha DBR10 powered speaker that she uses for ceremonies, and cocktail hour.


In the event of a Blown Speaker, a DJ should always have a back up ready to go. How many DJs who use RCF EVOX 8 or Bose L1/B2 system, or F1s have a complete back up system ready to go in their vehicle in case of failure? ....I bet the number is VERY LOW...All the DJs I have personally seen who use these speaker systems have no back up equipment in case of failure, OR they have a single low end speaker in their vehicle just in case of complete failure.

In theory, soeone who purchased a set of Mackie's back in 2006 or so who still have them today in good working order could go another 10 years using them at gigs. Same with QSC K12 from 10 years ago. As long as they continue to sound okay, and don't look awful, a DJ can just continue to use them.
 
My point was not that your sister should upgrade to new ones - it was to demonstrate that the ROI between something cheap and something better is not that big, especially the longer you use them.

Most professionals should have a backup - that backup may not be the same exact model or mfr but they should have a backup. A backup is like a spare tire - it's to get you through the end of the event.

You're right, in theory, as long as the equipment is working and in good condition, you can continue to use it - which makes less sense to buy cheaper stuff as the 'cost per event' is minimal for better quality and performing equipment.
 
Bose makes some nice stuff today that is good for some applications. Not for just any application. Depending on the size room you were in and the size crowd that system wouldn't be good enough.

You also talked about comparing those subs to the ones you have. They don't come close. That's like comparing the Yamaha subs I used to have to the 801p subs I have now. 2 or either 4 of those Yamaha subs put together can't touch even one of the 801p subs.
 
Sound was okay, and I feel I played the right material. Honestly, they got a deal, $1200 for photographer, DJ and photobooth for 2 hours. Like you described, the Bose sound is good for a lot of things but those subs delivered a lot less than I was expecting. Frankly, my Alto 15" subs are less than my old Yorkville, but they put out a TON more thump than those F1s did. Not sure if it was a problem with the setup but I doubt it. It was much the same tone as I've seen with my L1 rig. The L1 also had the lack of air on top, but I was able to overcome the thump by using my LS801ps. THAT is an awesome combination. In hindsight, I'd do exactly the same thing over again. I didn't have to setup my facade/table and I didn't have to setup my sound rig. The F1 was adequate, but still under-whelming to what I was anticipating. No disrespect to Bose. I like them and it's still the only name brand that brides have ever been able to identify with. Still the Altos with K10s on top absolutely, positively kills that F1 rig.
Could also have been the settings they had on the Bose .. or maybe some limiting or high-passing out of the Midas board.

Anywho .. as the others have said, most probably didn't notice.
 
RickRyan--

I am sorry, but the F1 series outruns a K series, by a long shot. I have owned both, and honestly, it's quite a big difference, especially on the low end, not to mention, sound quality and overall tone, especially when pushed!

I am going to assume there was some weird DSP going on you didn't know about through the house system, and what a shame you had a bad experience.

The F1 sub is no Yorkville 801, but it kicks ass, especially down around 40. Granted, I have NOT heard the Alto sub, but seriously, I cannot imagine it even coming close to the F1 sub. As I mentioned, a pair of F1 subs outruns a KW181 (not the greatest sub, but still...), and comes darn close to some of the high-end subs.

And like I keep on mentioning, the way it sounds, super thick and tubby-like a 18" makes them awesome for hip hop and dance music, not so great for rock, which is their weakness.

If you truly think the Alto model is better, which model do you have b/c I want it badly. I have yet to find a better sub for the size and weight and would love to give this Alto a try. In all seriousness, I will buy it right now.

I was really let down by the Dual 12 (semi horn loaded) sub on the ES1203 coming nowhere close the "ultra" low- end from the F1, but the tradeoff was more output and a punchier sound. Can't have it all, especially in a small package.

Lastly, I am going to assume you are one of those users who did not use the ToneMatch when running the L1. It's about the most airy sounding speaker you are going to find.
 
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From my experience, there's more to the value of good equipment that just great sound. Yes, we tell people what we use. It seems to have a positive result. Does it mean they wouldn't book without it? Doubtful. But it doesn't hurt. People know the brand name as premium and they seem to like knowing we spent money.

Secondly, because the equipment is seem as premium, it brings a great price on the resale market. Much more than other equipment I've sold.

A good company stands behind their stuff. I find great peace of mind knowing that my equipment will stand up to the rigors of the road. In the rare instance that something happens, I know I can count on them to quickly fix it. That's worth something to me.

Even when a product is no longer being serviced, they've helped out. I had one unit that died after 12 years. They gave me 50% off for a new system.

So yes, I believe paying for a premium brand is often worth it.
 
...How many DJs who use RCF EVOX 8 or Bose L1/B2 system, or F1s have a complete back up system ready to go in their vehicle in case of failure?...

ME!!![emoji1]... I have three EVOX-8’s. I keep one in my office for practicing, and the other two in the minivan. For gigs, I load the third one in the minivan and it stays in there unless I have to park a long distance from the venue door, in which case I take it in and keep it out of sight as much as possible. The reason I like the EVOX-8’s is the three of them take up less space in my minivan than my old subs and speakers.
 
In the event of a Blown Speaker, a DJ should always have a back up ready to go. How many DJs who use RCF EVOX 8 or Bose L1/B2 system, or F1s have a complete back up system ready to go in their vehicle in case of failure?

Me. Always.
 
The $7 chef’s knife with the hollow handle that presents a struggle with every meal vs. the quality $35 one that seems effortless.
The $20 backpack with poor stitching and no padding that falls apart after a year vs. the quality $75 one that lasts a decade or more and is super comfortable the entire time.
The $1 toothbrush that leaves your teeth feeling grimy vs. the $20 electric toothbrush that makes them feel like you just had a dental cleaning after every brush.
The $500 asphalt driveway that falls apart and needs re-surfacing every 3 years vs. the $2,000 concrete driveway that lasts 3 decades.
The $3 per pound pink slime vs. the $10 grass-fed organic steak.

Again I agree with you but these are all more tangible items than the sound of a speaker. Unless they are sitting in the crowd with RTA meters it's all opinion

I went to a wedding a few years back the guy playing had a mismatch of Yorkville and Peavey speakers and it sounded horrible. It took about an hour for me to have ear fatigue but it didn't seem to bother anyone else. There was actually one comment at my table a guy said sounds pretty good...I just agreed and moved on

I probably told this story before but I did a wedding about 10 years ago in a small community about 100 miles out of town. I was running 2 JBL tops and 2 JBL subs with Yamaha P-series amps. All night they kept asking me to turn it up...This wasn't a massive room maybe 2000 square feet if that. By midnight I had it almost wide open and they still were asking to turn it up. I was out walking the floors to make sure I wasn't missing something but everything was normal and VERY loud.

Anyway I got a good review for the event so it wasn't a problem but the guy travelling with me and I went for a beer over at the local bar with the Bridal party before we hit the road and as soon as I walked in I figured it out. It was screechy loud in there the sound was horrible. This is what they were used to so they didn't find good sound loud enough because it wasn't hurting their ears.

In this age if MP3 and compressed audio on the internet very few know what good sound is these days and to expect them to remember what the guy last weekend sounded like in comparison to this week is futile
 
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Could also have been the settings they had on the Bose .. or maybe some limiting or high-passing out of the Midas board.

I got to agree...I've heard the F1 and they sound pretty good when produced right
 
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here
Again I agree with you but these are all more tangible items than the sound of a speaker. Unless they are sitting in the crowd with RTA meters it's all opinion

I went to a wedding a few years back the guy playing had a mismatch of Yorkville and Peavey speakers and it sounded horrible. It took about an hour for me to have ear fatigue but it didn't seem to bother anyone else. There was actually one comment at my table a guy said sounds pretty good...I just agreed and moved on

I probably told this story before but I did a wedding about 10 years ago in a small community about 100 miles out of town. I was running 2 JBL tops and 2 JBL subs with Yamaha P-series amps. All night they kept asking me to turn it up...This wasn't a massive room maybe 2000 square feet if that. By midnight I had it almost wide open and they still were asking to turn it up. I was out walking the floors to make sure I wasn't missing something but everything was normal and VERY loud.

Anyway I got a good review for the event so it wasn't a problem but the guy travelling with me and I went for a beer over at the local bar with the Bridal party before we hit the road and as soon as I walked in I figured it out. It was screechy loud in there the sound was horrible. This is what they were used to so they didn't find good sound loud enough because it wasn't hurting their ears.

In this age if MP3 and compressed audio on the internet very few know what good sound is these days and to expect them to remember what the guy last weekend sounded like in comparison to this week is futile
I don't disagree - and better equipment will also generally perform better under stress - and can get louder with less distortion (obviously if the source material is bad, you can't fix that).